Addiction

[Bartmanhomer]

This is a good topic to discuss about. There's many types of addiction, food addiction, sugar addiction, shopping addiction, card collecting addiction (such as pokemon card game, tarot and other card type), drug addiction, alocohol addiction, smoking addiction and the list goes on. I don't see addiction as a disease with the expection of drugs, alcohol and smoking addiction. Addiction can be a fun and positive rush. What's your opinion on addiction?

[habbalah]

An addiction is not a "fun and positive rush". It's having your life taken over by something that you cannot emotionally, mentally, psychologically, even sometimes physically live without. Addiction is a disease. It can ruin your life. It can ruin the lives of people around you. Saying "oh, I have an addiction to x" is only cute and funny when it's not running your life into the ground. I've had addictions that financially ruined me. I have an alcoholic parent who is struggling daily with their addiction.

What you're speaking of as "fun and a rush" are hobbies. Activities. It might be fun to get drunk or smoke a joint once in a while. That's not the same as not being able to function without alcohol, or being stoned every day because you can't deal with reality.

Addictions are not a joke. Please don't take them lightly.

[B. de Corbin]

Addictions are what one does to fill in the emptyness of one's life.

Fill that emptyness, and addiction becomes a mere habit. IMHO.

[Azvanna]

Addiction can be a fun and positive rush. What's your opinion on addiction?

Yeah, because divorce, childhood neglect, debt, the feeling of utter hopelessness, profound intellectual and physical disability, painful withdrawal symptoms and death are all such a rush of fun and positivity.

BMH, Can you explain how you think addiction as opposed to an activity (eg drinking coffee) provides a fun and positive rush?

[thalassa]

Use of something, abuse of something, and addiction are not the same thing, whether its gambling or drugs or sex.

Use can be fine. In proper context, it can even be beneficial. Most of the time, its just fairly benign. Abuse on the other hand, will push yourself towards addiction eventually, and in the interim is pretty hard on your body. But addiction is plain bad--you aren't using something when you are addicted, you are letting it use you. In addiction, the rush is mostly gone (compared to just use) and you need whatever it is to just break even.

A bit simple, but this pretty much illustrates it perfectly:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FVSfVhvZmM0

The problem with this though, is the idea that doing it once makes you addicted, which for most people and most addictions, is not the case. And, of course, it brings with it the idea that abstinence is the only answer, when the problem isn't the substance, but what causes them to return to the substance over and over and over.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PY9DcIMGxMs

[Bartmanhomer]

To answer your question. Addiction can be a positive rush only in moderation and I already mention that addiction can be negative only with drugs, alocohol and smoking. And I really don't see it completely as a disease. There always a cure that people overcome addiction. Also addiction is not even a mental illness. If it was a mental illness there won't be no cure for it.

[Medusa]

http://images.dailytech.com/nimage/34759_large_You_Keep_Using_That_Word_Meme_FP_Wide. png

[habbalah]

To answer your question. Addiction can be a positive rush only in moderation and I already mention that addiction can be negative only with drugs, alocohol and smoking. And I really don't see it completely as a disease. There always a cure that people overcome addiction. Also addiction is not even a mental illness. If it was a mental illness there won't be no cure for it.

Addiction is an illness (http://www.asam.org/quality-practice/definition-of-addiction), it is mental (http://www.ama-assn.org/ama/ama-wire/post/addiction-treatment-boost-under-new-federal-bill)and there is no cure. You repeating that doesn't make it not true. There are treatments, but one is never cured from alcoholism. They are recovering.

Only drugs are negative addictions? What about gambling? Sex? Self-injury? Eating disorders? Shopping to the point of running yourself into debt or ruin? If you don't believe any of these exist, use Google. I shouldn't have to provide links. The very definition of addiction disagrees with your assertion of its meaning (emphasis mine):

noun
1.
the state of being enslaved to a habit or practice or to something that is psychologically or physically habit-forming, as narcotics, to such an extent that its cessation causes severe trauma.

What about that sounds like a "fun rush" to you? You are not an addict if you are able to enjoy something in moderation. Do. Research. Before you start making topics of discussion, please, for the love of whatever gods you believe in.

[thalassa]

http://images.dailytech.com/nimage/34759_large_You_Keep_Using_That_Word_Meme_FP_Wide. png

BMH, I have to agree with this^

Repeating your incredibly unscientific and wrong opinion doesn't make it correct.

[anunitu]

There is addiction,and then there is Obsession....

[monsno_leedra]

Addiction has a clinical definition for certain but you'd still be surprised just how many caregivers use their own definition. I recall I was taking close to 30 aspirin a day without even thinking about it and brought it up to my doctor at the time. She was positive you couldn't become addicted to aspirin. It wasn't an addictive substance in her opinion. Definitely not fun and games at the time.

[thalassa]

Addiction has a clinical definition for certain but you'd still be surprised just how many caregivers use their own definition. I recall I was taking close to 30 aspirin a day without even thinking about it and brought it up to my doctor at the time. She was positive you couldn't become addicted to aspirin. It wasn't an addictive substance in her opinion. Definitely not fun and games at the time.


To be sure there is lots of misinformation, even among health professionals, and to be sure there are many areas of contention, incomplete conclusions, and uncertainty...add to that the idea of habituation often being conflated with addiction, and often times people are using the same terminology to describe apples and zebras.

But that doesn't make this any closer to a factual statement:



To answer your question. Addiction can be a positive rush only in moderation and I already mention that addiction can be negative only with drugs, alocohol and smoking. And I really don't see it completely as a disease. There always a cure that people overcome addiction. Also addiction is not even a mental illness. If it was a mental illness there won't be no cure for it.


There's not even a single idea in there that has any basis in any remotely medical or scientific ideas about addiction.


That sort of statement is not only wrong, but wildly unhelpful and possibly dangerous to someone that might believe it.

[Bartmanhomer]

Addiction is an illness (http://www.asam.org/quality-practice/definition-of-addiction), it is mental (http://www.ama-assn.org/ama/ama-wire/post/addiction-treatment-boost-under-new-federal-bill)and there is no cure. You repeating that doesn't make it not true. There are treatments, but one is never cured from alcoholism. They are recovering.

Only drugs are negative addictions? What about gambling? Sex? Self-injury? Eating disorders? Shopping to the point of running yourself into debt or ruin? If you don't believe any of these exist, use Google. I shouldn't have to provide links. The very definition of addiction disagrees with your assertion of its meaning (emphasis mine):

noun
1.
the state of being enslaved to a habit or practice or to something that is psychologically or physically habit-forming, as narcotics, to such an extent that its cessation causes severe trauma.

What about that sounds like a "fun rush" to you? You are not an addict if you are able to enjoy something in moderation. Do. Research. Before you start making topics of discussion, please, for the love of whatever gods you believe in.

I already did my research. Gambling is a tricky one. You'll win so much much if you're lucky but you'll lose a lot of money. Sex is also a tricky one as well. Well I already mention my Porn Addiction thread in the Adult forum. It's give you pleasure and satisfaction in your love love but it'll give you negativity in a long run. So gambling and sex is in the gray area. Self-injury and eating orders is very negative. I can't lie aout that. Shopping is also a tricky one. You get all the items that want but yoou have trouble paying the bills. So shopping it's in the gray area. I'll tell you a story about my first addiction. Many years ago I brought over 20 tarot decks. Was it problematic for me? Yes. Did it ruin my life? No. So anyway I throw all my tarot decks in the garabe and I learn a lesson. The lesson is that I have to be more careful not being over addicted to tarot. Do it in moderation.

[ThePaganMafia]

I already did my research. Gambling is a tricky one. You'll win so much much if you're lucky but you'll lose a lot of money.

I worked in the casino industry as a dealer after I left the Army. Gambling is one of the most crippling habits I have ever seen. Luck has nothing to do with gambling. It is mathematics. The House holds a 2-8 percent edge on every game. So, what that means is the house averages 2-8 cents of profits on every dollar bet. The more money bet=the higher bottom line. Luck does not beat mathematics.

When people say they're winning what they really mean is that they are having an upswing from the average. Their long term average is always a loss. The crux of gambling addiction is that "win". The amount of money won doesn't matter. Winning releases dopamine in the brain. It essentially has the same affect as a drug. That's why so all casino advertisements have a variation of the word "win" in them.

Gambling is horrible. I have seen it destroy lives. Dealing is the one job I had where I hated myself for what I was paid to do. Casino dealers are no different than drug dealers.

[Medusa]

If it's in moderation, it's not an addiction. You are factually wrong about addiction. Stop it.

[EndlessCravings]

This is so confusing.

[anunitu]

As they say,the house always wins...but that is over time with a few ups and downs..but over time they always win..

[THANK...]

From your friend Google: Addiction is a substance or action "that can be pleasurable but the continued use/act of which becomes compulsive and interferes with ordinary life responsibilities..."

As Anton LaVey says, 'indulgence not compulsion', in other words, pleasure over addiction. Addiction keeps you awake at night when you need to go to sleep for work or school for the sake of pornography, drinking to the point of bloody knuckles and walking 3 hours home after 2 am in the rain, for example. Indulgence is staying awake with friends or family on a weekend (your weekend) while talking about life and concepts, and having a hoot, or sexing up a beautiful person, or drinking enough to laugh at the joke that is life and let go of inhibitions, yet still getting on the right bus home or listening to your friend and getting in the car to get safely back to a sleeping environment.

Addiction hurts in many ways. Nothing fun. All bad.

[habbalah]

I already did my research. Gambling is a tricky one. You'll win so much much if you're lucky but you'll lose a lot of money. Sex is also a tricky one as well. Well I already mention my Porn Addiction thread in the Adult forum. It's give you pleasure and satisfaction in your love love but it'll give you negativity in a long run. So gambling and sex is in the gray area. Self-injury and eating orders is very negative. I can't lie aout that. Shopping is also a tricky one. You get all the items that want but yoou have trouble paying the bills. So shopping it's in the gray area. I'll tell you a story about my first addiction. Many years ago I brought over 20 tarot decks. Was it problematic for me? Yes. Did it ruin my life? No. So anyway I throw all my tarot decks in the garabe and I learn a lesson. The lesson is that I have to be more careful not being over addicted to tarot. Do it in moderation.

If you did research, you didn't do enough. If you're addicted to something, you lack the ability to do it in moderation. You may have bought 20 tarot decks and threw them away. Maybe you were addicted. Maybe you were just obsessed with the idea of collecting them. And maybe now you can collect decks in moderation. Then you're not currently addicted, because you have the ability to control how much you do it, and not to excess.

There is no grey area in regards to addiction. Not gambling, not shopping, not sex, nothing. If you are addicted, it's negative. I don't often say this here, but you are wrong, and no matter how many times you say it, it doesn't make the fact that addiction is always negative not a fact. One of the rules here is to not couch personal opinion as fact, which you are clearly doing. You are using addiction to mean activity or even habit. If you have actual research or evidence to the contrary, please post it. Until that time, the medical, psychological, and dictionary definitions of "addiction" disagree with you.

[Bartmanhomer]

Habballah, I'm sorry that addiction has cause you so many issue but like I said addiction is a tricky subject.

[habbalah]

Habballah, I'm sorry that addiction has cause you so many issue but like I said addiction is a tricky subject.

I want evidence of your claim that an addiction can be positive besides personal anecdotes. Please provide some.

[DanieMarie]

Full disclosure - I haven't read the rest of this thread, because it's three pages long and I don't have time right now.

But the OP is definitely alarming. I suspect most of the other posts (or all of them) take issue with it as well, but I want to say my piece. There is a HUGE difference between a passion and an addiction. Collecting Pokemon cards, shopping for deals, gaming, etc are hobbies for a lot of people, and they're hobbies that a lot of people are passionate about. Likewise, some people are very enthusiastic about wine, whiskey, gourmet food, and that sort of thing. That's all fine and good, and people can even let those things cross over into a lifestyle without entering addiction territory (for example, I know a few sommeliers and wine dealers who basically live and breathe wine without being alcoholics). An addiction, however, is a different beast. When you have an addiction, you don't consume something; it consumes you. You are not in control, and it starts affecting the rest of your life. Your desire for finding deals while shopping puts you into debt, your alcohol consumption makes you sick, your food consumption makes your weight spiral out of control, your gaming addiction alienates your friends and family, etc. Those aren't fun and enjoyable consequences.

[habbalah]

Full disclosure - I haven't read the rest of this thread, because it's three pages long and I don't have time right now.

But the OP is definitely alarming. I suspect most of the other posts (or all of them) take issue with it as well, but I want to say my piece. There is a HUGE difference between a passion and an addiction. Collecting Pokemon cards, shopping for deals, gaming, etc are hobbies for a lot of people, and they're hobbies that a lot of people are passionate about. Likewise, some people are very enthusiastic about wine, whiskey, gourmet food, and that sort of thing. That's all fine and good, and people can even let those things cross over into a lifestyle without entering addiction territory (for example, I know a few sommeliers and wine dealers who basically live and breathe wine without being alcoholics). An addiction, however, is a different beast. When you have an addiction, you don't consume something; it consumes you. You are not in control, and it starts affecting the rest of your life. Your desire for finding deals while shopping puts you into debt, your alcohol consumption makes you sick, your food consumption makes your weight spiral out of control, your gaming addiction alienates your friends and family, etc. Those aren't fun and enjoyable consequences.

Passion. That's the word I've been going for all the time but couldn't pull out of my brain.

[B. de Corbin]

I think BMH is using the wrong word - he is using "addiction," when he means "the occasional use of."

Addiction is something else completely.

[Bartmanhomer]

Here's proof: http://www.psychologydictionary.org/positive-addiction/

[DanieMarie]

Because everything the Internet says is totally sound...

[iris]

Just gonna put this here because it touches on some very valid points about the term 'positive addiction'
https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/philosophy-stirred-not-shaken/201411/are-there-positive-addictions

[anunitu]

I had a "passion" for booze,BUT I ended up on the floor a lot because I was so passionate:rolleyes::=):

[Bartmanhomer]

That's my proof of positive addiction. :)

[anunitu]

Does spending the night in Jail seem positive?

[monsno_leedra]

I can think of a situation where people are addicted to working out and it might be perceived of as being positive. it's of benefit to their health and mental well being and their schedule is the addiction in having to do it. But I think that would be the exception more than the norm to describing something as an addiction.

[iris]

I can think of a situation where people are addicted to working out and it might be perceived of as being positive. it's of benefit to their health and mental well being and their schedule is the addiction in having to do it. But I think that would be the exception more than the norm to describing something as an addiction.

I've had a friend who was addicted to working out. Nothing positive about that, she couldn't stop even when she got injured.
The article I posted before made the point that positive addiction is an oxymoron... it makes no real sense to attach the word addiction - a word that is inherently negative - to a behaviour that is supposedly purely positive.

[Medusa]

Let's go to the experts on addiction and ask them:
Philip Seymour Hoffman
Cory Monteith
Whitney Houston
Amy Winehouse
Michael Jackson
Billy Mays
Heath Ledger
Anna Nicole Smith
Ike Turner
......

Go on Bart. Ask them.

[anunitu]

enny meany,chili beany...the spirits are about to speak......
https://i.chzbgr.com/full/6946817792/hAD04B412/

[Bartmanhomer]

Like I said before Addiction isn't all that negative.

[iris]

Yes... that is exactly what addiction is. Negative.

[Medusa]

Like I said before Addiction isn't all that negative.

Did you even google the people on my list? Let me help you. THEY ARE ALL DEAD DUE TO THEIR ADDICTION. Get a clue.

[habbalah]

That's my proof of positive addiction. :)

That's not proof. It's a single possible concept, with a single-line definition.


Like I said before Addiction isn't all that negative.

This is supposed to be a discussion. You have provided a single link with a definition that has no citations as your proof. Follow forum rules and prove what you say is fact with actual research. It's extremely frustrating that you continue to do this: you post something and say you think this. When asked for any sort of proof, you keep repeating yourself for pages, and then either link to something that doesn't actually support your claim, or has no real research behind it. That is not how logic works.

[monsno_leedra]

I've had a friend who was addicted to working out. Nothing positive about that, she couldn't stop even when she got injured.
The article I posted before made the point that positive addiction is an oxymoron... it makes no real sense to attach the word addiction - a word that is inherently negative - to a behaviour that is supposedly purely positive.

That's why I said it might be perceived of as a positive addiction. I know more than a few who work out and the schedule and working out is an addiction to them in that it also motivates them. Yet at times it's also the addiction is adhering to the schedule even though the physical fitness aspect is not really the addicted aspect.

[Bartmanhomer]

I think I better research a bit more on addiction. I thought at first that addiction was a positive thing. :(

[habbalah]

I think I better research a bit more on addiction. I thought at first that addiction was a positive thing. :(

You've been told for several days now that it's not, with research and definitions that it's not. What made you just now change your mind?

[Bartmanhomer]

Ok now I get the idea what addiction really is: http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/info/addiction/ Sorry for the faulty logic and argument for beliving addictions is a good thing everybody. :(

- - - Updated - - -

Really? It's been that long? I was being young and small-minded about it.

[B. de Corbin]

Well, that Glasser actually wrote about "positive addiction" puts you in good company. Glasser is a huge name in education, and he caused a sea-change in the way educators (ideally) relate to students.

But I agree more with the critique of the term that Iris posted. Positive addiction looks like a misuse of the term "addiction," to me.