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    What is your opinion on labels?

    I've found labels to be somewhat distracting and confining when it comes to spirituality. Any thoughts on this? I hope i've articulated the my point well.

    #2
    Re: What is your opinion on labels?

    I think its useful for the purposes of communication and organization..and the fact that it falls short of the totality is sort of irrelevant, unless you are defining yourself or your practice purely by that label.
    Wonderful Life: The Burgess Shale and the Nature of HistoryPagan Devotionals, because the wind and the rain is our Bible
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      #3
      Re: What is your opinion on labels?

      Labels are fine as long as you don't expect them to tell you the whole story....
      www.thewolfenhowlepress.com


      Phantom Turnips never die.... they just get stewed occasionally....

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        #4
        Re: What is your opinion on labels?

        I find it's best to place them on everything! That way I don't confuse my myrrh with deerstongue. Oh, you mean...oh...

        They serve a purpose. While I like to put "Kemetic" for my path it's truly Kemetic Reconstructionist, for example. So when people ask me what I am I explain I'm a Kemetic Reconstructionist and follow up with any other explanations. Like thal said it's to give people a better idea what you believe as well as others who fall under the same path. The latter part seems less apparent because Neo-Pagans tend to be very decentralized right now.
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          #5
          Re: What is your opinion on labels?

          They can be useful when looking for information or talking to people just as long as you remember that they're descriptive tools not straightjackets.

          They can also be mildly entertaining to misuse or take out of context but that may just be my perverse desire to crack bad jokes instead of actually try and explain myself.
          life itself was a lightsaber in his hands; even in the face of treachery and death and hopes gone cold, he burned like a candle in the darkness. Like a star shining in the black eternity of space.

          Yoda: Dark Rendezvous

          "But those men who know anything at all about the Light also know that there is a fierceness to its power, like the bare sword of the law, or the white burning of the sun." Suddenly his voice sounded to Will very strong, and very Welsh. "At the very heart, that is. Other things, like humanity, and mercy, and charity, that most good men hold more precious than all else, they do not come first for the Light. Oh, sometimes they are there; often, indeed. But in the very long run the concern of you people is with the absolute good, ahead of all else..."

          John Rowlands, The Grey King by Susan Cooper

          "You come from the Lord Adam and the Lady Eve", said Aslan. "And that is both honour enough to erect the head of the poorest beggar, and shame enough to bow the shoulders of the greatest emperor on earth; be content."

          Aslan, Prince Caspian by CS Lewis


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            #6
            Re: What is your opinion on labels?

            Originally posted by thalassa View Post
            I think its useful for the purposes of communication and organization..and the fact that it falls short of the totality is sort of irrelevant, unless you are defining yourself or your practice purely by that label.
            This. Labels give us general ideas, sometimes very general. They're akin to the thesis statement in a term paper; they're opening statements that let people know basically what you're talking about. The label becomes troublesome when stereotypes and erroneous beliefs come into play, which is what necessitates further explanation.

            Our own inner thoughts and beliefs - or maybe it's just mine - are often hard to verbalize. This is why labels are pretty well worthless when it comes to internal contemplation and journeying. We know what our basic beliefs are so the labels are hardly necessary in that case. It's our job to work with our deities and/or spirits (if any) and build upon these beliefs and expand them for ourselves.
            Children love and want to be loved and they very much prefer the joy of accomplishment to the triumph of hateful failure. Do not mistake a child for his symptom.
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              #7
              Re: What is your opinion on labels?

              Originally posted by greenwood01 View Post
              I've found labels to be somewhat distracting and confining when it comes to spirituality. Any thoughts on this? I hope i've articulated the my point well.
              I think labels are a good thing in that, as long as both people involved agree on the meaning of the label, it gives a reasonably strong starting point in any conversation. For example, if I was to label myself a Wiccan, one could make some reasonable assumptions about what I believe and how I practice saving the need for much in the way of explanation at the beginning of any discussion.

              Where I think labels may be a little detrimental in terms of spirituality is that they can make people feel as if they have to fit in to perfect little boxes. On another forum I am on one of the most common concerns from the newbies is that they don't know what to call themselves, or what path they are on. Finding the right label can then become more important to them than actually looking at what works on a personal level and creating their own path.
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                #8
                Re: What is your opinion on labels?

                Originally posted by Tylluan Penry View Post
                Labels are fine as long as you don't expect them to tell you the whole story....
                That's how I feel too. I also feel labels shouldn't constrain you. One thing I HATE about Germany (and this goes beyond spirituality into pretty much everything in general) is that they want to label everything and make everything fit in a box. That's not how life works anymore and it just creates a lot of inflexibility, resistance to change and an overall 'bureaucratic nightmare' situation (and yes, I know bureaucracy is annoying everywhere, but Germany just brings it to a whole new level). Spiritually, it just feels like you either have to be one thing or another. You can't be influenced by two or more things. And I hate that attitude.

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                  #9
                  Re: What is your opinion on labels?

                  Because you can't tell a once racked, single malt scotch that is over 30 years old unless you read the label or open it ...
                  I won't be wronged. I won't be insulted. I won't be laid a-hand on. I don't do these things to other people, and I require the same from them ... John Bernard Books


                  Indian Chief 'Two Eagles' was asked by a white government official; "You have observed the white man for 90 years. You've seen his wars and his technological advances. You've seen his progress, and the damage he's done."

                  The Chief nodded in agreement.

                  The official continued; "Considering all these events, in your opinion, where did the white man go wrong?"

                  The Chief stared at the government official for over a minute and then calmly replied.. "When white man find land, Indians running it, no taxes, no debt, plenty buffalo, plenty beaver, clean water. Women did all the work, Medicine Man free. Indian man spend all day hunting and fishing; all night having sex."

                  Then the chief leaned back and smiled; "Only white man dumb enough to think he could improve system like that."



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                    #10
                    Re: What is your opinion on labels?

                    Originally posted by thalassa View Post
                    I think its useful for the purposes of communication and organization..and the fact that it falls short of the totality is sort of irrelevant, unless you are defining yourself or your practice purely by that label.
                    ^I agree with this.

                    ---------- Post added at 12:08 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:07 PM ----------

                    Originally posted by Tylluan Penry View Post
                    Labels are fine as long as you don't expect them to tell you the whole story....
                    And this too.

                    ---------- Post added at 12:09 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:08 PM ----------

                    Originally posted by magusjinx View Post
                    Because you can't tell a once racked, single malt scotch that is over 30 years old unless you read the label or open it ...
                    And this also.
                    Gargoyles watch over me...I can hear them snicker in the dark.


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                      #11
                      Re: What is your opinion on labels?

                      I have a problem with the labels that *I* fall under because they are wholly inaccurate.

                      I am not a shaman. In fact, I don't think that anyone unless they have lived the life of a shaman and grew up in the Native American ways is a shaman. It simply isn't authentic. You can't just pick up a book, decide you like power animals, and then call yourself a shaman (which is what happened with me). Besides, the shamanistic ways were taught, not written, so I distrust anything in a book when it comes to REAL shamanism because the Native Americans do not readily share those secrets with anyone, let alone some doofus with a pen and paper.

                      I could go on about how I feel Native American culture has been bastardized enough and they don't need me fucking it up even more, but I'll refrain.

                      On the whole, labels are nothing more than WORDS. WORDS are effing useful because they clearly and succinctly transfer the jist of ideas into another person's head. As for getting super technical with what exactly a person is or isn't, most of the time it's unnecessary. When communicating with people who only need the jist of what you are, then words like shaman, Kemetic, Heathen, etc are important to convey the umbrella under which you fit most. They don't need to be bogged down with the semantics of what it is that you TRULY believe because it's wasting your jewels on swine (I know that's not the actually saying, but I wanted to say it this way).

                      And then, when it comes to people that you know can understand and appreciate the many facets of your multidimensional spirituality, they'll know that those umbrella words are simply devices for the ignorant and will be willing to listen to further explanation, thus allowing you to share your spirit with worthy people.
                      No one tells the wind which way to blow.

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                        #12
                        Re: What is your opinion on labels?

                        Labels are a descriptive tool and to me, a nessecary part of verbal communication. The issue I see a lot is when they stop being descriptive and become definitive. When they are used in this fashion they start restricting the object/entity they are attached to, because now instead of adding descriptors to communicate an idea you are adding to the idea to fit the definition. Unfortunately this is a mindset and those with that mindset will define rather than describe.
                        I have rambled on long enough thank you for reading.
                        If men had wings and bore black feathers, few of them would be clever enough to be crows. ---Henry Ward Beecher

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                          #13
                          Re: What is your opinion on labels?

                          Originally posted by Crynnath View Post
                          Labels are a descriptive tool and to me, a nessecary part of verbal communication. The issue I see a lot is when they stop being descriptive and become definitive. When they are used in this fashion they start restricting the object/entity they are attached to, because now instead of adding descriptors to communicate an idea you are adding to the idea to fit the definition. Unfortunately this is a mindset and those with that mindset will define rather than describe.
                          This is basically what I think. I agree with the OP that labels seem to get messy and just deter us from what we're actually trying to accomplish spiritually. Like shadow said:

                          Where I think labels may be a little detrimental in terms of spirituality is that they can make people feel as if they have to fit in to perfect little boxes. On another forum I am on one of the most common concerns from the newbies is that they don't know what to call themselves, or what path they are on. Finding the right label can then become more important to them than actually looking at what works on a personal level and creating their own path.
                          This is a problem I had many years ago and one that is still frustrating to see when I read through websites and forums. People themselves either start thinking that they need to fit perfectly into the box of a label and start stunting their own intellectual thought process and spiritual growth, or, as I see more commonly, other people harass them for not "truly" being this, that, and the other thing because a true *whatever* believes this and this and not that, blah blah blah.

                          We can't get rid of labels entirely because they're necessary for communicating with others. But I think people need to calm down about the specific definitions. I myself don't care to really search for a label for myself unless somebody really finds it necessary for me to do so.
                          Last edited by AuroraWinters; 11 Nov 2011, 10:19.

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                            #14
                            Re: What is your opinion on labels?

                            Labels should identify.
                            Satan is my spirit animal

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                              #15
                              Re: What is your opinion on labels?

                              I think words have power so you should always be careful about what you call yourself or other people because what you say and what you think you can manifest. I agree they have their uses but I think the world in general is taking them to a whole different level and uses them to put people into neat little categories and that doesn't always work. Instead of giving people a sense of belonging, its leading people to think they don't fit and that should never be the case. I guess its the old adage of the tool is only as good as the person yielding it

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