Correllian Nativist Tradition

[Celtic Tiger]

I have been aware of this tradition for a little while; an ex-girlfriend (now just a friend) had studied Correllianism and a mutual friend of ours is of some degree higher than first. My then G/F had recommended a book on the subject, called "Witch School: First Degree" and also referred me to the site (http://www.correllian.com/). There is apparently a Maryland based temple (http://www.the-sacred-light-temple-md.org/home.html)

I just started reading the book and really like what I am seeing in terms of how they present their tradition and beliefs. My former G/F is still very positive about her experience, and witch whom I trust said good things about it.

I don't know if there is anyone here who follows this tradition, but I figured that the Wicca & Witchcraft section would be a good place to start.

[MaskedOne]

Re: Correllian Nativist Tradition

Last time I ran across them, an argument that started somewhere else found its way into PF. They chose not to stay. Other than that, shrug, I wouldn't fit well with them but that's not a major failing. Their site annoys me and the zodiac calendar that conveniently lines up with the Gregorian in abbreviated form strikes me as a 'we're special' gimmick but I am feeling cynical and I haven't dealt enough with them to make a solid case for or against.

[Jembru]

Re: Correllian Nativist Tradition

Hmm, this is just my opinion so don't let it influence you. I have their guidebooks for 1st, 2nd and 3rd degree. My coven got hold of them when we were trying to develop our own degree system. Personally, I wasn't impressed. Not because they're bad as such. It's just that what they present as more 'advanced' material, is simply more complex stuff. So at second degree, you have to learn kabbalah (or was it 3rd), because they consider it harder to learn. What kabbalah has to do with wicca, I don't know. A wiccan may choose to study such things, but personally, I feel they have no place in the core study of degrees.

That said, I've recently started to suspect we weren't that typical of wiccan groupes and were more like a gathering of hedgewitches with far more shamanic values. My own coven was all about getting to know ourselves and our interaction with the world and people and spirits in it. We developed our strengths and loo using them to become the very best we can. We got to know local plants and wildlife, involved ourselves with the local community. This kind of thing is missing from the Correllian study guides. No two covens are the same and all paths have different values, but it used to worry me that someone could study the craft as though it were a subject like chemistry, just a bunch of facts to reel off, without any of the spiritual and psychological development and exploration, and yet still call themselves elders.

[Celtic Tiger]

Re: Correllian Nativist Tradition

Hmm, this is just my opinion so don't let it influence you.

I appreciate the qualifier. Just to be clear though, when I solicit opinion, I do so because I am interested in what people have to say. So your opinion is valuable to me.

I have their guidebooks for 1st, 2nd and 3rd degree. My coven got hold of them when we were trying to develop our own degree system. Personally, I wasn't impressed. Not because they're bad as such. It's just that what they present as more 'advanced' material, is simply more complex stuff. So at second degree, you have to learn kabbalah (or was it 3rd), because they consider it harder to learn. What kabbalah has to do with wicca, I don't know. A wiccan may choose to study such things, but personally, I feel they have no place in the core study of degrees.

I studied Kabballah on its own many years ago and while I found it interesting, I was not particularly drawn to it. I also found much of the complexity to simply be there for it's own sake.

That said, I've recently started to suspect we weren't that typical of wiccan groupes and were more like a gathering of hedgewitches with far more shamanic values. My own coven was all about getting to know ourselves and our interaction with the world and people and spirits in it. We developed our strengths and loo using them to become the very best we can. We got to know local plants and wildlife, involved ourselves with the local community. This kind of thing is missing from the Correllian study guides. No two covens are the same and all paths have different values, but it used to worry me that someone could study the craft as though it were a subject like chemistry, just a bunch of facts to reel off, without any of the spiritual and psychological development and exploration, and yet still call themselves elders.

I suspect that I am probably closer to hedge-witch/shamanic in terms of what I feel drawn towards, but I do like what has been presented thus far and thought of it as worthy of study, even if I don't do more than read it as an academic pursuit.

- - - Updated - - -

Last time I ran across them, an argument that started somewhere else found its way into PF. They chose not to stay. Other than that, shrug, I wouldn't fit well with them but that's not a major failing. Their site annoys me and the zodiac calendar that conveniently lines up with the Gregorian in abbreviated form strikes me as a 'we're special' gimmick but I am feeling cynical and I haven't dealt enough with them to make a solid case for or against.

The site was a bit gimmicky, but I figure it is what it is; some people like that, some don't. I can take it or leave it. I haven't delved into it deeply enough to have an opinion, but as long as it is functional and I can access the information that I need, the packaging of the site is not a consideration for me. I did like that they don't seem to be out to gouge people out of hideous amounts of cash, something that I have seen plenty of in both churches and in the martial arts (long MA background and have seen more seemingly super traditional schools with well done websites that are nothing but window dressing for money grabbing frauds).

I'll see where things go and keep the thread updated.

Thank you for responding!

[Jembru]

Re: Correllian Nativist Tradition

It sounds like you would be able to keep an open mind if you were to study with them, so I don't see what you'd have to lose. It's like the book I am studying from. I go back to it every few years because I find the exercises and the ritual style very useful. The author however, isn't very likable. She is quite arrogant and has a writing style so similar to Silver Ravenwolf, that if there weren't a photo of her, I'd swear it's the same lady writing under a new pen name. She also makes claims like, 'the Celtic people worshipped a three-fold goddess as maid, mother and crone'. Still, I keep on open mind, don't swallow the parts that seem flaky, and actually get a lot from the book. There's treasure in the most unlikely places.

Good luck!

[Celtic Tiger]

Re: Correllian Nativist Tradition

So far, the book has been pretty good. It is set up with twelve lessons, each taking a month to complete. I am working on lesson one and have read it in its entirety. Nothing earth shattering, but I wouldn't expect as much in lesson one of anything.

Nothing flaky so far either. I will keep the topic updated as time goes by.

[Jembru]

Re: Correllian Nativist Tradition

When was the book written? It was about 7 years ago that U saw their curriculae, they may have advanced a lot since then. Sounds good either way!

[Celtic Tiger]

Re: Correllian Nativist Tradition

I'll have to look when I get home. There isn't anything in what I have read so far that is date specific.

[Vigdisdotter]

Re: Correllian Nativist Tradition

Man, I haven't been in this forum in forever.

Okay, let me start of by saying I have a low opinion of book learning and websites that claim to teach people. There are a lot of reasons here, so bear with me.

I should point out that I personally LOVE books, I love collecting them and reading them. But there are two big problems with book learning (and only one of which is the books "fault). Books at static things. They present the author's views on specific subjects and nothing more. There is no way to question the author or their claims, what you see is all you get. This leads into the second problem (that the books AREN'T responsible for) which is that people think what eh book contains is all there IS and they stop looking, assuming they have the answers. I'm not saying you or anyone else will fall into this trap, but it's something to be aware of no only for your own practice but when talking to others whose ideas are based on book learning.

Websites often suffer form the above two problems as well, but in this internet age, it's often easy to email, message, or otherwise contact someone and talk to them about the content of their page. This is what a lot of internet schools are based on, using a tutor based model. And that does help. The problem is that unless the person is in the same town as you and can meet you in person there is a LOT that simply doesn't translate to written language. The Mysteries being the most obvious example, that's why they are called Mysteries. But it's also littler things as well, like being able to check if a student is properly grounded or having the student feel what you're doing with the energy while casting a circle.

So in a nut shell, take any book teaching/learning and websites with a BIG grain of salt and keep your eyes open for people in meat life that can help you.

[Celtic Tiger]

Re: Correllian Nativist Tradition

Man, I haven't been in this forum in forever.

Okay, let me start of by saying I have a low opinion of book learning and websites that claim to teach people. There are a lot of reasons here, so bear with me.

I should point out that I personally LOVE books, I love collecting them and reading them. But there are two big problems with book learning (and only one of which is the books "fault). Books at static things. They present the author's views on specific subjects and nothing more. There is no way to question the author or their claims, what you see is all you get. This leads into the second problem (that the books AREN'T responsible for) which is that people think what eh book contains is all there IS and they stop looking, assuming they have the answers. I'm not saying you or anyone else will fall into this trap, but it's something to be aware of no only for your own practice but when talking to others whose ideas are based on book learning.

Websites often suffer form the above two problems as well, but in this internet age, it's often easy to email, message, or otherwise contact someone and talk to them about the content of their page. This is what a lot of internet schools are based on, using a tutor based model. And that does help. The problem is that unless the person is in the same town as you and can meet you in person there is a LOT that simply doesn't translate to written language. The Mysteries being the most obvious example, that's why they are called Mysteries. But it's also littler things as well, like being able to check if a student is properly grounded or having the student feel what you're doing with the energy while casting a circle.

So in a nut shell, take any book teaching/learning and websites with a BIG grain of salt and keep your eyes open for people in meat life that can help you.

I appreciate the response!

I'm mainly researching the tradition at this point. Looking over the book and the lessons and I'll see where I am with it after I've done that. Definitely not looking at it as an end all be all, and I'm in no hurry to "be Correllian" though I must say, it does have a cool ring to it.

[Celtic Tiger]

Re: Correllian Nativist Tradition

I have finished the first lesson. Basic stuff, nothing revolutionary. But it's lesson one, so I wasn't expecting anything different. I'll start lesson two tomorrow.

[Louisvillian]

Re: Correllian Nativist Tradition

So at second degree, you have to learn kabbalah (or was it 3rd), because they consider it harder to learn. What kabbalah has to do with wicca, I don't know. A wiccan may choose to study such things, but personally, I feel they have no place in the core study of degrees.

I can kinda see the angle of it. Wicca developed from the Western occult tradition, which is strongly rooted in Hermeticism and Kabbalah. Understanding Kabbalah makes sense from a historical perspective. Knowing how it works and how the societies that formed around it work is a bit helpful in understanding more fully where Wicca comes from and why its ritual structure and some practices are the way they are.
But actually learning it and integrating it wholesale as part of the path seems a bit...I dunno, too New Agey? Like it's trying to blend incompatible systems just for the sake of blending. It seems silly and unproductive to me.

[Jembru]

Re: Correllian Nativist Tradition

I can kinda see the angle of it. Wicca developed from the Western occult tradition, which is strongly rooted in Hermeticism and Kabbalah. Understanding Kabbalah makes sense from a historical perspective. Knowing how it works and how the societies that formed around it work is a bit helpful in understanding more fully where Wicca comes from and why its ritual structure and some practices are the way they are.
But actually learning it and integrating it wholesale as part of the path seems a bit...I dunno, too New Agey? Like it's trying to blend incompatible systems just for the sake of blending. It seems silly and unproductive to me.

I never thought of it like that before. I suppose a loose understanding may have some value after all. I heard that the original symbols that represent first, second and third degree came from the tree of life, but I never really considered the system as having an influence on modern wicca. Maybe it is something I should look into a little more. My issue is that I really can't stand A. Crowley and you can't get too far into the history of Wiccan ritual style, before you bump into him. Like it or not, he had a big part to play and that has always put me off wanting to know too much ^^

[Louisvillian]

Re: Correllian Nativist Tradition

I recognise the history and move on. It's an influence on how the religion developed, yes. But what's most important is what it is now, which is composed of people like us, practising the religion as it exists. I mean, I'm also not going to let the fact that Gerald Gardner made a lot of it up stop me from practising Wicca.
I'm a history buff and I'll straight-up say: history is history, it happened and it's over. It made its impact, but the best thing to do is learn by it, not agonise or obsess. Or let it become a barrier to exploring things and doing what you want.