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B. de Corbin
12 Jun 2016, 04:44
No - not "radical Muslums." I am waiting to see what kind of terrorism this is - it is, appaerently anti-gay, but will it be Christian terrorism, Conservative terrorism, or a case of mental illness, or what?

Shooting Rampage Results In ‘Mass Casualties’ At Orlando Nightclub (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/shooting-rampage-results-in-mass-casualties-at-orlando-nightclub_us_575d4469e4b0ced23ca845a2)

From the article:


ORLANDO, Fla. (Reuters) - A gunman shot dead about 20 people and injured 42 others in a crowded gay nightclub in Florida early on Sunday before being killed by police in what U.S. authorities described as a “domestic terrorism incident”.

thalassa
12 Jun 2016, 05:23
Saw a news report that the gunman has been identified as Omar Mateen (http://www.cbsnews.com/live/?ftag=CNM-00-10aab7e&linkId=25462185) and another report about Islamic terrorist sympathies (http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2016/06/12/shooting-orlando-club/85785254/).

Denarius
12 Jun 2016, 05:29
From your link:


When asked if the FBI suspected that the gunman may have an extremist leanings, including a possible sympathy with Islamic State, Ronald Hopper, an assistant FBI agent in charge, said: “We do have suggestions that the individual may have leanings toward that particular ideology. But right now we can’t say definitively.”

I don't know where you are getting the idea that the shooter definitely, or even probably, wasn't a radical Muslim from. Didn't get that impression from any of the articles I've read, again, including the one you linked.

Edit:

Perhaps the article you linked was updated since you posted, and it did imply or state that before.

B. de Corbin
12 Jun 2016, 05:46
Saw a news report that the gunman has been identified as Omar Mateen (http://www.cbsnews.com/live/?ftag=CNM-00-10aab7e&linkId=25462185) and another report about Islamic terrorist sympathies (http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2016/06/12/shooting-orlando-club/85785254/).


Oh crap. Xoxoxo

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From your link:



I don't know where you are getting the idea that the shooter definitely, or even probably, wasn't a radical Muslim from. Didn't get that impression from any of the articles I've read, again, including the one you linked.

Edit:

Perhaps the article you linked was updated since you posted, and it did imply or state that before.

Lay it on. Bad Karma incurred for thinking politics before compassion.

Denarius
12 Jun 2016, 05:57
Lay it on. Bad Karma incurred for thinking politics before compassion.

I don't understand what you mean by this, can you clarify?

Hawkfeathers
12 Jun 2016, 05:58
How awful for everyone who was there and their loved ones. The pro and anti gun people are going to be out in full force, and the white anti-gays will be a little confused due to the nationality of the shooter. Hopefully those two hatreds will cancel each other out.

B. de Corbin
12 Jun 2016, 06:04
I don't understand what you mean by this, can you clarify?

I get bad Karma, for which I pay for wrong thinking. You delivered it. I accept as my due. That's all.

monsno_leedra
12 Jun 2016, 06:46
Evidently it's starting to look like he's American but his parents are from Afghanistan. But it's still a developing story.

Would add its 50 dead and 53 injured according to the latest report I read.

ThePaganMafia
12 Jun 2016, 07:14
The rhetoric begins.

B. de Corbin
12 Jun 2016, 07:17
The rhetoric begins.

Screw the rhetoric. Death toll is up to 50, 53 critically injured, and is the worst mass shooting in U.S. History.

ThePaganMafia
12 Jun 2016, 07:34
Well, the rhetoric is important because rhetoric inspires emotions, hate, and negative action. Changes in rhetoric dependent on the shooters background are also interesting.

So, Omar Mateen's parents have apologized and said religious ideology had nothing to do with the attack. He became angered several months ago when his three year old son saw two men kissing. He's from New York. He was also a notary in Florida and a security guard. Just what I have found via the Google.

B. de Corbin
12 Jun 2016, 07:37
So, Omar Mateen's parents have apologized and said religious ideology had nothing to do with the attack. He became angered several months ago when his three year old son saw two men kissing. He's from New York. He was also a notary in Florida and a security guard. Just what I have found via the Google.

Hmm... Interesting. So "Omar" does not equal "Muslim terrorist"

thalassa
12 Jun 2016, 07:59
I'll be the one to say it--this is what happens when you like in a country that abhors civility and compromise and loves restricting every amendment of its founding ideals (sometimes in quite reasonable ways) but one. Whether extremism played a role in this or not, I'm willing to say a flawed view of religion's teachings most certainly did...and in that vein, it could just have easily been a Christian going coocoo.

Hawkfeathers
12 Jun 2016, 08:11
CNN mentioned that people were going in there to "clean up". I can't even imagine how traumatic that kind of thing must be, no matter how someone is trained.

B. de Corbin
12 Jun 2016, 09:47
It appears that a planned attack was prevented at the Gay Pride rally in L.A.

EndlessCravings
12 Jun 2016, 11:35
It appears that a planned attack was prevented at the Gay Pride rally in L.A.

Yep. Heard about it about an hour ago. Good thing they caught him before he could do any damage.

anunitu
12 Jun 2016, 12:02
Gad,nothing like stirring the whole election pot...shootings will be right up there with emails and Mr. T's collage of business.

Hawkfeathers
12 Jun 2016, 12:21
People are saying Pres. O. should be impeached because he didn't say "radical Islamic terrorism". I'm gonna guess if the shooter had been some Billy Bubba from Backwatersville, they'd be saying God wanted those victims dead.

anunitu
12 Jun 2016, 12:22
I just saw this,having just gotton back on Cable and Internet.

volcaniclastic
12 Jun 2016, 13:05
I don't understand why people have to die because they think something, or love someone different than you.

Society.

B. de Corbin
12 Jun 2016, 13:47
Gad,nothing like stirring the whole election pot...shootings will be right up there with emails and Mr. T's collage of business.


Trump has already tweeted about how right he was.

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I don't understand why people have to die because they think something, or love someone different than you.

Society.

Don't blame society. Blame self righteous jackasses.

anunitu
12 Jun 2016, 14:44
I go by one basic rule,live and let live,rinse and repeat.....

Medusa
12 Jun 2016, 20:15
Trump has already tweeted about how right he was.

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Don't blame society. Blame self righteous jackasses.

That's about 54% of society.

ThePaganMafia
12 Jun 2016, 21:04
Reading my Facebook feed today, I became convinced that the terrorists won.

Denarius
12 Jun 2016, 21:39
>Facebook

If you really want to lose faith in humanity try /pol/.

Hawkfeathers
13 Jun 2016, 04:36
Society spends a lot of time on the character & motivation of criminals, and little on the victims. Children who bully other children, set fires, harm animals? Oh, send them to therapy and they'll be fine.....No. Put them away. Husbands who are violent and abusive to their wives? Put them away. Employees who hit other employees? (Yeah, it happens, it happened here in my town and the man still has his job.) - Put them away. College student rapes another student? Put them away. Our prisons are full of pot smokers, we have no more mental hospitals, and those with criminal personality traits breed freely. Every cult out there blames victims (You attract what you send out. You wore the wrong clothes. You let them abuse you. Etc.) Stop it. Nip it in the bud. Put them away.

B. de Corbin
13 Jun 2016, 06:30
That's about 54% of society.


But 46% of us aren't.

The cup is half full at the same time that it is half empty.

anunitu
13 Jun 2016, 06:53
Teacups do not shoot people,people shoot teacups full of people!!!!!(Wake up dude,we are almost home..Yeh Morrison,James Morrison)

BTW,even I know I am crazy...

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I am also not making light of 50 people dieing..I am working through the steps of loss is all..Denial comes first..

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And now comes Anger,the spewing of obscenity about the guy who opened fire on all those innocent people celebrating their "Equality" and acceptance after so long..

The shooter was killed,but that was not enough punishment..May he rot in the deepest darkest depths of Hell.

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Steps of loss here. (http://psychcentral.com/lib/the-5-stages-of-loss-and-grief/)

kalynraye
13 Jun 2016, 07:32
Based on Fox news that has been blaring in my house since ohhh 7 o'clock this morning(someone put me out of my misery) he called 911 and pledged himself to Isis on the phone... anyone actually heard the phone call where he did this? All I can say is this was a terrible event, a devastating event and I'v got people on my facebook going. "I hope you'd be this upset if it was a straight club." or "Its a sin to talk about "straight pride." my other favorite "it's not about gun control."

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Correction CNN is also saying the same thing that he pledge to Isis on the phone.

ThePaganMafia
13 Jun 2016, 07:42
He called 911 and pledged himself to ISIS. Which has got to be the most counter-productive way of joining ISIS that I can imagine. It's east to say, "Well, there you go! ISIS is attacking us! The Muslims are coming to kill us!" and the line of thinking ends there. Spread the fear and hate.

The guy had no connection to ISIS. He wasn't sent by ISIS. According to the guys ex-wife the guy had been an abusive lunatic for years. So, it's easy to feel like this some terrorist attack without looking at the man. Which is something we only seem to do for white mass shooters.

kalynraye
13 Jun 2016, 08:15
Yeah that's all I have heard since it came out that he pledged himself to Isis. Its a terrorist attack Obama is a horrible president for not shutting down Isis, and this is not a gun issue.

anunitu
13 Jun 2016, 08:18
I think at times melting all the guns would be good,but they most likely would turn those melted guns into knives,or bombs,or even metal stones to throw at their own glass houses.

DragonsFriend
13 Jun 2016, 08:44
The tool that a criminal uses is never the problem. The criminal is the problem. If you want to rid society of violence then deal with the violent people.

kalynraye
13 Jun 2016, 08:49
Unfortunately we are going to have to agree to disagree on this topic. I don't think the point of this topic was to turn it into a debate on gun control. So we'll just leave it at agree to disagree.

anunitu
13 Jun 2016, 08:55
I am still a bit in shock,even though these things have become common place.

B. de Corbin
13 Jun 2016, 09:58
Yes, please. Let us not do gun control here.

If people still have a taste for that argument, a new thread would do.

anunitu
13 Jun 2016, 10:04
Not gun control...but perhaps a better people connection that does not harbor anger and hate.

Tylluan Penry
13 Jun 2016, 11:15
Worth listening to...
http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/commentisfree/video/2016/jun/13/owen-jones-orlando-shooting-massacre-terrorist-will-fail-heres-why-video

thalassa
13 Jun 2016, 12:50
Correction CNN is also saying the same thing that he pledge to Isis on the phone.


Of course he did. What better way is there to get notoriety and attention than that? I mean, school and movie shooters get forgotten in a month or two (who even remembers the orange hair kid's name? or the other one? I sure don't...) but terrorism paranoia is strong in this country. Donnie will be all over this until at least November.

Bartmanhomer
13 Jun 2016, 12:53
Why was I born a country full of hate? Sometimes I wish that there's no hate period. :mad:

anubisa
13 Jun 2016, 19:01
I can't believe all this. I'll be praying for all the families. I just don't know why anyone would do such a thing.

monsno_leedra
13 Jun 2016, 19:56
It seems that the shooter had also been canvassing a Disney location as a potential target. Other Disney locations ruled out due to the presence of both guards and metal detectors if early reports are accurate. So between canvassing the night club and the Disney Location it has the potential that the target was not specifically chosen due to the clientele but the soft target status of an easily penetrated and open target environment.

Doesn't change the pain and suffering inflicted on those killed and wounded, nor lessen the horror of it, but it does change what the totality of the event could have been. We may never know why he chose one place over the other. I don't like to even think of how it could have been worse but depending upon what the specifics of the Disney location might have held it potentially could have been a wider spread of age groups and people present.

B. de Corbin
13 Jun 2016, 20:57
Donnie will be all over this until at least November.

Oh my god how right you are. It has already gone from proto-Nazi to full blown Nazi.

Tylluan Penry
13 Jun 2016, 23:18
Oh my god how right you are. It has already gone from proto-Nazi to full blown Nazi.

And that, Corbin, is something that bothers me. A lot. Because I have been wondering throughout this...
I'm not saying any more specifically, (Don't want DT to send the storm troopers round here) but it does seem a tad... convenient, doesn't it? And the quick back-tracking to claim it couldn't have been a homophobic attack because of scouting around Disneyland.

None of which lessens the horror of what has happened. My thoughts and blessings go to those injured and the spirits and families of those killed in Orlando. I cannot imagine what they must be going through.

B. de Corbin
14 Jun 2016, 00:22
I don't have the same unstated suspicions that you have, but I have the absolute certainty that the event will be exploited by power seekers, and it will not be good for us peons.

anunitu
14 Jun 2016, 02:34
There is some information that this guy hung around the club a lot longer than for "Casing" the place. It seems several people in the local Gay community ran across him on online gay dating apps. That and he was known from the club over a much longer time than needed to check the club out. It has been suggested that it was latent gay feelings that set him off,but no solid proof of that as yet.

Hawkfeathers
14 Jun 2016, 03:49
Reports have said he was angered by seeing 2 men kissing....maybe one of them was his love interest and he was jealous? Who knows. I stand by my original belief that he should have been removed from society when he beat his wife.

B. de Corbin
14 Jun 2016, 04:47
Dizzy, I'm so dizzy my head is spinning
Like a whirlpool it never ends...

A guy went into a night club and shot over a hundred people. Is there anything else we really need to know?

thalassa
14 Jun 2016, 05:16
A guy went into a night club and shot over a hundred people. Is there anything else we really need to know?

Not really...its all armchair q-backing/side-seat driving at this point. TBH, I think they should have a moratorium on speculative reporting until official reports are completed..

Monk
14 Jun 2016, 05:49
I'm numb, shocked, sickened, and .....sad, all these feelings and so many more. My prayers go out for the victims, their families and loved ones. I called my son who is gay when I heard of this horrific attack in Orlando. He lives here in the metro Detroit area and is a gay rights activist. I just need to talk to him, you know hear his voice even thought I knew he was safe. I can not begin to imagine the panic in the hearts of the people who had loved ones in that club!

As for HATE we need to look at ourselves. Do we inadvertently promote it by not speaking up when we hear others say things like faggot, nigger, dyke, or any other form hate in our presence? Do we inadvertently give our approval to this type of terrorism with our silence? This is not just about guns or politics, it's also about our failure to speak up and say no to such hatred and the people who feel they have the right for any reason to promote it.

ThePaganMafia
14 Jun 2016, 07:25
Anyways, about 12 days until America completely forgets about this shooting so that they can be completely shocked and dumbfounded by the next.

DanieMarie
14 Jun 2016, 09:37
So apparently he frequented that club and spent a lot of time on gay dating apps. I think this is a lot more complicated than it looks.

monsno_leedra
14 Jun 2016, 09:53
So apparently he frequented that club and spent a lot of time on gay dating apps. I think this is a lot more complicated than it looks.

I have to agree. It's like there is one thing missing here though. We have the 911 call declaring his commitment to ISIS yet so far I've not heard of a single witness / survivor making any reference to him saying "Allah Akbar" which seems to be a fairly common statement in extremist Muslim Attacks. Perhaps he did during the final shootout perhaps not but when trying to play on the Islamaphobia it seems the media never misses that aspect.

Medusa
14 Jun 2016, 10:11
Sometimes a human being will kill and be a shitty human being and still just be a regular old American Muslim Orlando human being.

Lots of people who kill could put down a religion on their paperwork. Doesn't mean they are one.

The reason this person killed people is because he is a fucked up individual. The end. Doesn't matter what protest group we join. The world is the world is the world. I'll be honest. I'm completely apathetic to the entire situation. Which is my usual mo when it comes to the world in general. It makes me comfy and cozy. Just being really honest.

DanieMarie
14 Jun 2016, 10:57
I have to agree. It's like there is one thing missing here though. We have the 911 call declaring his commitment to ISIS yet so far I've not heard of a single witness / survivor making any reference to him saying "Allah Akbar" which seems to be a fairly common statement in extremist Muslim Attacks. Perhaps he did during the final shootout perhaps not but when trying to play on the Islamaphobia it seems the media never misses that aspect.

My theory is that he was messed up and latched onto the crazy ideology he could most closely identify with. Had he been white, it probably would have been neo-Naziism or militant fundamental Christianity, but he wasn't white, so.....

I definitely think it has less to do with militant Islam and more to do with a very troubled (to put it lightly) person.

Bartmanhomer
14 Jun 2016, 11:33
Look the point is that America went completely downhill ever since so many major and negative events has happen. There's hasn't been any improvement at all. So therefore America stinks. Another reason that I would like to point out that the gunman was an ISIS member and he killed 50 people. Some of them might be heterosexual and straight. Who knows when more information comes into light. Also the gunman was insane.

anunitu
14 Jun 2016, 11:40
America may not always be the true land of the free,and home to equality..BUT it is a damn site better here than in other countries. Unless you have visited other less progressive countries you have no idea how good we have it here. I see how screwed up things can be,but good things have also happened. Glass half full,or half empty,at least we have glass to empty or fill.

ThePaganMafia
14 Jun 2016, 11:41
He was not a member of ISIS.

Bartmanhomer
14 Jun 2016, 11:45
America may not always be the true land of the free,and home to equality..BUT it is a damn site better here than in other countries. Unless you have visited other less progressive countries you have no idea how good we have it here. I see how screwed up things can be,but good things have also happened. Glass half full,or half empty,at least we have glass to empty or fill.

True. Also I believe his intention was just pure hate.


He was not a member of ISIS.

Really? Are you sure? :confused:

anunitu
14 Jun 2016, 11:46
Yeh PM,he just tried to latch on to that to seem not closeted gay who was angry about his orientation.. I knew this guy up in Albany who was like that,HATED gays to the point of always pointing out where all the gay bars were..and he was also Jewish,and HATED JEWS..seemed a bit obsessed with gays... I just figured he would at some point explode or go hook up with another guy....

ThePaganMafia
14 Jun 2016, 11:47
America may not always be the true land of the free,and home to equality..BUT it is a damn site better here than in other countries. Unless you have visited other less progressive countries you have no idea how good we have it here. I see how screwed up things can be,but good things have also happened. Glass half full,or half empty,at least we have glass to empty or fill.

I've never liked this logic. It reminds me of a saying we have in Alabama: Well, at least we ain't Mississippi. Sure, it could be worse but it has little to do with whatever the issue is and generally is an apathetic response to an attempt at positive change. And when it comes to mass shootings and gun violence we aren't ranked very high in the safety category among anybody.
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T

Really? Are you sure? :confused:

Unless 911 is the new ISIS pledge line.

anunitu
14 Jun 2016, 11:54
So,fix the whole country...make people not hate each other,make sure everyone has enough to eat,and can get higher education so they can live a decent life. Teach male children they can't just rape women,and everyone is equal and entitled to their share of the pie. Just keep saying,give peace a chance,and Imagine how much better the world and the US can be.

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I will admit,I have no real idea just why this guy did what he did,but as Duce said F'd up is F'd up period.

DanieMarie
14 Jun 2016, 11:59
I've never liked this logic. It reminds me of a saying we have in Alabama: Well, at least we ain't Mississippi. Sure, it could be worse but it has little to do with whatever the issue is and generally is an apathetic response to an attempt at positive change. And when it comes to mass shootings and gun violence we aren't ranked very high in the safety category among anybody.


Same. Germany does it all the time, and although we have it pretty good here, we also majorly fail in some areas. There's always room for improvement.

Personally, I can think of around 30 countries I'd prefer to live in over the US, but I'm sure I can find just as many that I'd find worse. When it comes to this sort of thing, something is going wrong, and I think it needs to get fixed. This doesn't happen in other places to anywhere near the same extent. And no, we're not naturally more peaceful or less multicultural (seriously, go to Vancouver or Toronto or London if you think that).

Medusa
14 Jun 2016, 12:08
I think we should stop looking for the 'reason' why he killed these people. I mean is there any valid reason other than they were like hostile aliens coming for us? No. It doesn't matter the reason. Because there are about 5 different groups we want to protest and call the bad guys. Humans are bad. I don't care why he did it. We still will be a homophobic country. We still will be a let's hide domestic battery country. We still will be a let the rapists off if the woman was to blame for her extra high heel. We still will be a country that will hate Islam and Atheists and that particular style of Christianity that isn't your Christianity. The reasons will mean absolutely nothing. Except on which symbol to change our fb profile pic to.

Hawkfeathers
14 Jun 2016, 12:35
I think we should stop looking for the 'reason' why he killed these people. I mean is there any valid reason other than they were like hostile aliens coming for us? No. It doesn't matter the reason. Because there are about 5 different groups we want to protest and call the bad guys. Humans are bad. I don't care why he did it. We still will be a homophobic country. We still will be a let's hide domestic battery country. We still will be a let the rapists off if the woman was to blame for her extra high heel. We still will be a country that will hate Islam and Atheists and that particular style of Christianity that isn't your Christianity. The reasons will mean absolutely nothing. Except on which symbol to change our fb profile pic to.

I agree for the most part. His particular reason won't be the next one's reason. However, we could learn from history and get tougher on assault crimes, as I've said repeatedly. But we won't because the poor misunderstood bad guy blah blah blah.

DanieMarie
14 Jun 2016, 12:46
I don't think that it's helpful to look into the reason this particular guy killed these particular people, but I think it *is* worth looking into the reasons why the US has so many more mass killings than the rest of the developed world.

Denarius
14 Jun 2016, 13:44
why the US has so many more mass killings than the rest of the developed world.

Adjusted by proportion (http://crimeresearch.org/2015/06/comparing-death-rates-from-mass-public-shootings-in-the-us-and-europe/), that doesn't really hold up. We've had this discussion, it's also disingenuous to compare the US as a whole to pretty much any other country. We also look pretty good compared to Russia (http://www.npr.org/sections/parallels/2013/09/19/224043848/the-u-s-has-more-guns-but-russia-has-more-murders), on a murder to murder basis, which is one of the few developed nations that actually does directly compare to the US.

I still can't find any data about China though.

Bartmanhomer
14 Jun 2016, 14:00
I'm sorry but this whole story is so confusing. Why was the gunman using the gay app on his phone anyway?

anunitu
14 Jun 2016, 15:27
If we gots to explain BMH,we gonna need diagrams and pictures,and some of the words will be rated adults only...

Medusa
14 Jun 2016, 16:14
I don't think that it's helpful to look into the reason this particular guy killed these particular people, but I think it *is* worth looking into the reasons why the US has so many more mass killings than the rest of the developed world.

Freedom. Murica and all that crap. You give freedom to everyone that means you give freedom to everyone

We can't pick and choose. I mean we could. But then we'd be Hitlers.

anunitu
15 Jun 2016, 08:55
This just about tops the republican mind set,ignore everything that are facts,and go with your really stupid vision of the world from inside the republican bubble.

Story here. (http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/gop-lawmaker-says-orlando-shooting-site-wasnt-gay-club)

Asked on Tuesday afternoon whether the massacre of 49 people at an Orlando gay nightclub changes his opposition to a pro-LGBT bill, House Rules Committee chairman Pete Sessions (R-TX) denied the venue had anything to do with the gay community whatsoever. “It was a young person’s nightclub, I’m told. And there were some [LGBT people] there, but it was mostly Latinos,” told reporters, according to National Journal.

This guy needs to be dropped right in the middle of the REAL America,to get a really good tune up....

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And then the GOP thinks THIS will work.

There appears to be a push in Republican circles this week to exploit the bloodshed in Orlando to woo LGBT voters. The pitch, in effect, is ugly but straightforward: a Muslim killed 49 people in a gay nightclub; Republicans are anti-Muslim; therefore LGBT voters should support Republicans.

If GOP officials seriously expect this strategy to work, they’re going to be disappointed.

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Also it kind of explains why no republicans can figure out why the whole mob is streaking towards that bottomless pit ahead...

Hawkfeathers
15 Jun 2016, 09:25
I watched some of the speeches/coverage yesterday/ day before. The most valid and moving part was Anderson Cooper reading the names of the deceased. (I think this is a personal "trigger" thing for me because of the annual reading of the names from 9/11 where I totally lose it when they get to those I knew). And the ex-wife was hard to watch. She knew this guy was trouble, and got away from him, knowing but unable to prove that some vague "something" was seriously going on with him. Another trigger I guess, because it was the same for me. About a year after my divorce, my ex went on a rampage, holding people hostage, etc. No one was killed but he did 7 or 8 years for having an illegal gun and all the rest of it. And I knew he would do something someday, but of course had no idea what, nor had anything substantial to base that knowledge on, and everyone ignored me anyway. So I feel for her, and the survivors of the shooting.

DanieMarie
15 Jun 2016, 09:29
Freedom. Murica and all that crap. You give freedom to everyone that means you give freedom to everyone

We can't pick and choose. I mean we could. But then we'd be Hitlers.

Sorry, but the US isn't the only free country in the world.

anunitu
15 Jun 2016, 09:45
Not really sure Duce attacked any other country..and yes we have way to many mass killings...Hopefully we do not open any detention camps,as that has a bad history,with the Japanese Americans that happened too.

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Sorry if I veered off topic for a second there.

monsno_leedra
15 Jun 2016, 09:51
Here's another thing to ponder. The media made a big deal of the shooter's father saying he'll never forgive him. What if we're all reading that statement wrong. What if the thing he'll never forgive him for is being Gay? Then trying to find some sort of closure or acceptance he strikes at what his father will never forgive him for? Granted just speculation and mental musing on my part but it is something that crossed my mind.

Doesn't justify or condone what the shooter did in anyway so please don't even think I'm suggesting that.

thalassa
15 Jun 2016, 09:59
Sorry, but the US isn't the only free country in the world.

Yeah, but we're the only free country with guns out their yahoos for anyone tall enough to reach the trigger .

DanieMarie
15 Jun 2016, 11:38
I also do think it's about more than gun control. I think that's a huge factor, but I think that socioeconomic inequality, the education system, the justice system, and the health care system all play strong roles in this.

B. de Corbin
15 Jun 2016, 12:33
I also do think it's about more than gun control. I think that's a huge factor, but I think that socioeconomic inequality, the education system, the justice system, and the health care system all play strong roles in this.


Hopelessness. The feeling (real or imagined) that no matter what you do you are screwed. Leaves people with the desire to lash out, just because they feel it is all hopeless anyway.

People with hope think about tomorrow, people without hope dream of the apocalypse where all scores are settled with finality.

anunitu
15 Jun 2016, 13:10
And that B. De,seems to be the whole magilla in a nut shell..those that do nothing believing that Jeebus gonna ride in on a white horse,and those that know the horse has died,and Jeebus just left Chicago.


https://youtu.be/vMjqgIZ1_YM

Bound for New Orleans.

Bartmanhomer
15 Jun 2016, 14:48
And that B. De,seems to be the whole magilla in a nut shell..those that do nothing believing that Jeebus gonna ride in on a white horse,and those that know the horse has died,and Jeebus just left Chicago.


https://youtu.be/vMjqgIZ1_YM

Bound for New Orleans.
Is there a point to this music video?

anunitu
15 Jun 2016, 14:51
If I must explain it to you,you most likely would never understand.

Medusa
15 Jun 2016, 15:00
Sorry, but the US isn't the only free country in the world.

I'm sure you know what I mean. Come on.

anunitu
15 Jun 2016, 15:02
I do not know Duce,watch "Brain dead",it caught my attention. It might explain all things concerning this election year...on CBS

thalassa
15 Jun 2016, 15:23
I also do think it's about more than gun control. I think that's a huge factor, but I think that socioeconomic inequality, the education system, the justice system, and the health care system all play strong roles in this.

Of course they do. Because freedom. See, here in Murika, we know you European folks really aren'tt free. You are brainwashed into thinking you are free, but really you are patsies of your government...or some such muckity-muck...I stopped listening to the dude's rant (this was from an actual statement @ work) about 30 seconds in.

Here in Murika, you have to work real hard and pull yourself up by your bootstraps. Because here in Murika you are responsible for your failure. If you can't make a living, it because you didn't try hard enough. If you can't afford a doctor, that's your own fault because you don't have a good enough job...you should have worked harder.

Here in Murika, we don't pay for losers to see a doctor. Suck it up and get back to work and stop sponging off us hard working folks.

Tylluan Penry
16 Jun 2016, 03:22
Of course they do. Because freedom. See, here in Murika, we know you European folks really aren'tt free. You are brainwashed into thinking you are free, but really you are patsies of your government...or some such muckity-muck...I stopped listening to the dude's rant (this was from an actual statement @ work) about 30 seconds in.

Here in Murika, you have to work real hard and pull yourself up by your bootstraps. Because here in Murika you are responsible for your failure. If you can't make a living, it because you didn't try hard enough. If you can't afford a doctor, that's your own fault because you don't have a good enough job...you should have worked harder.

Here in Murika, we don't pay for losers to see a doctor. Suck it up and get back to work and stop sponging off us hard working folks.


Bloody hell. ;)

Hawkfeathers
16 Jun 2016, 04:19
Of course they do. Because freedom. See, here in Murika, we know you European folks really aren'tt free. You are brainwashed into thinking you are free, but really you are patsies of your government...or some such muckity-muck...I stopped listening to the dude's rant (this was from an actual statement @ work) about 30 seconds in.

Here in Murika, you have to work real hard and pull yourself up by your bootstraps. Because here in Murika you are responsible for your failure. If you can't make a living, it because you didn't try hard enough. If you can't afford a doctor, that's your own fault because you don't have a good enough job...you should have worked harder.

Here in Murika, we don't pay for losers to see a doctor. Suck it up and get back to work and stop sponging off us hard working folks.

Add this kind of thinking to easily available guns, and you get why some individuals will snap and kill others. We have this thing in our culture where we strive for freedom at any cost - it's the Marlboro man riding his horse across an open plain, it's Bon Jovi singing "I ain't gonna do what I don't want to", it was Frank Sinatra singing "I did it my way", and a million other earworms/eyeworms that we grow up with...BUT then we are told to conform, act and dress in competition/conformation with others, go to work long hours, etc. Freedom is something few can attain, and even fewer can manage. The majority go blindly along with the crowd, but some see through the game, and, not being accepted for who they are, they realize the human race has trolled them, and they want to fight back. Many tame this reaction by drinking/drugging it into submission, some just give up and let their light go out, a lucky few have the resources to live their life as they see fit, and some just snap.