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Position of rune(s) when cast

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    Position of rune(s) when cast

    śivāya vishnu rūpaya śivaḥ rūpaya vishnave
    śivasya hridayam viṣṇur viṣṇoscha hridayam śivaḥ


    #2
    Re: Position of rune(s) when cast

    As my ol' buddy Russ the Runester used to say, "Runes are runes." They mean what they mean, they do what they do. Divinationally speaking, turning a rune backwards, upside down, or inside out is not going to change that rune's intrinsic nature, what that rune is. Magically speaking, there are some exceptions to this, such as when reversing a rune changes it into another rune (for example, Algiz in the Elder Futhark, when reversed, becomes the Younger Futhark rune Yr), or maybe when invoking different magical aspects of a rune. Algiz upright resembles female genitalia, reversed it resembles male genitalia; Thurisaz, depending on visual perspective, might symbolize a thorn for piercing, or a hammer for smashing (or simply Thor's hammer, Mjollnir, representing divine protection). But for the most part, when divining with runes, look for any & all possible meanings. It usually doesn't take long to glean which aspect is speaking to you. And don't forget, a lot of meaning can be taken from a rune's shape.
    I often wish that I had done drugs in the '70s. At least there'd be a reason for the flashbacks. - Rick the Runesinger

    Blood and Country

    Tribe of my Tribe
    Clan of my Clan
    Kin of my Kin
    Blood of my Blood



    For the Yule was upon them, the Yule; and they quaffed from the skulls of the slain,
    And shouted loud oaths in hoarse wit, and long quaffing swore laughing again.

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      #3
      Re: Position of rune(s) when cast

      Thanks Rick. Because I'm very new to using runes I didn't want to overthink it, so before I got too far, I thought I'd ask. What I do with the runes, at this stage, is simply do a 3 or 5 rune casting thinking about something going on with me. I don't believe they can predict the future, if they can, I don't have the talent to see it. So far they've told me about myself. When I read their meanings, I usually think "ahh-ha! so that's what's happening", and I can begin to see the forest for the trees. Maybe I can change things, or maybe I should just ride it out. Alternately I just draw them without any particular thought other than seeing what they come up with. I interpret them as best I can and think of what I can make of the day. I guess I skew the meaning to a more positive note, whether that's what someone else would say they mean or not. Things like that. Upg, I guess.
      śivāya vishnu rūpaya śivaḥ rūpaya vishnave
      śivasya hridayam viṣṇur viṣṇoscha hridayam śivaḥ

      Comment


        #4
        Re: Position of rune(s) when cast

        Everything about divination with runes is upg. "Murkstave" was invented at the same time as "blank" runes, and was heavily influenced by tarot. I strongly agree with don't over-think it.
        I often wish that I had done drugs in the '70s. At least there'd be a reason for the flashbacks. - Rick the Runesinger

        Blood and Country

        Tribe of my Tribe
        Clan of my Clan
        Kin of my Kin
        Blood of my Blood



        For the Yule was upon them, the Yule; and they quaffed from the skulls of the slain,
        And shouted loud oaths in hoarse wit, and long quaffing swore laughing again.

        Comment


          #5
          Re: Position of rune(s) when cast

          Thanks. I'm glad you mentioned murkstave. I Googled it and found this as the first hit http://runesecrets.com/rune-lore/murk-staves I am already working my way through that site... what a coincidence.
          śivāya vishnu rūpaya śivaḥ rūpaya vishnave
          śivasya hridayam viṣṇur viṣṇoscha hridayam śivaḥ

          Comment


            #6
            Re: Position of rune(s) when cast

            There was a mention of the "blank" rune, and figured I'd throw a little of my thoughts into here. While I don't look at the blank rune as having a meaning all on its own, I do use it myself. The way in which I do my readings, if the blank one winds up touching a rune, I look at it as that rune being very important.

            The way I look at it, runes are physical representations of sound and the energy of such. In that concept, the existence of a "blank" rune makes sense as the lack of a rune would mean the lack of sound. Thus, the blank rune is silence. It is the thing that comes before and after, and in between all others, sort of like a clean canvass before the painting, and the spaced and edges around the finished product.

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              #7
              Re: Position of rune(s) when cast

              I don't read runes according to their orientation, but to their position on the mat and in relation to each other. My experience is that rune meanings don't change whether they are upright, sideways or 'reversed' (which in itself is a silly way to describe an upside down image). I also literally cast my runes rather than lay them out, so they tend to land every which way.

              To me, a myrkstafr is one that lands face down, thus being 'hidden'. It's meaning isn't different though... it indicates a rune that has hidden or background influence.

              Having said that, I do know casters who read orientation. I figure if that's the way the runespirits talk to them then who am I to naysay?

              Comment


                #8
                Re: Position of rune(s) when cast

                My own feeling - and I should state at the outset here that I use that Anglo-Saxon runes and thus the AS Rune Poem - is that the runes offer us a 'window' into the larger whole. We need to first understand the whole and then we can pick out the other bits. There was a time, long ago, when I let myself listen to those who insisted that an upside down rune somehow reversed the meaning, but no, it doesn't. The runes IMHO work as patterns, showing us trends, influences and giving advice. It highlights cause and effect - if you do such and such then XYZ might happen. I tend always to cast in groups of three, and for me it's the pattern of the group that matters most. I really don't worry which way they come out of the bag!

                The thing about the runes - whichever system you choose to use - is that they don't work in a vacuum. They are part of the culture and outlook of their rune poem, and the world that gave birth to it.
                www.thewolfenhowlepress.com


                Phantom Turnips never die.... they just get stewed occasionally....

                Comment


                  #9
                  Re: Position of rune(s) when cast

                  Thanks for the replies, all this really helps in learning.

                  Originally posted by Rae'ya View Post
                  I don't read runes according to their orientation, but to their position on the mat and in relation to each other. My experience is that rune meanings don't change whether they are upright, sideways or 'reversed' (which in itself is a silly way to describe an upside down image). I also literally cast my runes rather than lay them out, so they tend to land every which way. ...
                  So, the consensus looks to be that orientation doesn't matter in and of itself. I read somewhere that they are placed right to left if drawn and read that way. Is that right? Or is that one of those things that doesn't matter either?

                  Originally posted by Tylluan Penry View Post
                  ... the runes offer us a 'window' into the larger whole. We need to first understand the whole and then we can pick out the other bits. ...
                  Yes, this is something I keep foremost in mind. They won't tell me what to do, or what will happen, they just give insight into what's going on, and self-reflection. For example, I interpreted the runes I drew last night as saying there is harmony in my home and marriage, but I have to work hard at keeping myself calm. I tend to be rash, get angry quickly, am easily provoked (but calm down quickly - a true Thorsman ), and things get only as bad as I make them.
                  śivāya vishnu rūpaya śivaḥ rūpaya vishnave
                  śivasya hridayam viṣṇur viṣṇoscha hridayam śivaḥ

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Re: Position of rune(s) when cast

                    Originally posted by Thorbjorn View Post
                    So, the consensus looks to be that orientation doesn't matter in and of itself. I read somewhere that they are placed right to left if drawn and read that way. Is that right? Or is that one of those things that doesn't matter either?
                    It depends on what layout you use. I don't use layouts, but I've seen lots and lots in various books and websites, ranging from a simple right-to-left past-present-future to full tarot-style Celtic-Cross to 24-rune concentric circle year-ahead spreads. So there's no 'correct' answer to this.

                    I think what's important is to find the system that gets you the clearest interpretation. How it's done doesn't really matter... as long as it gets you the results. At the end of the day we don't even know whether the runes were ever used for divination historically... the only references we have to divination in our Northern ancestors refers to 'certain signs' and never uses the term 'rune' at all. So no one can argue what the 'correct' or 'ancient' way to read runes was... because we don't know it!

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Re: Position of rune(s) when cast

                      Originally posted by Rae'ya View Post
                      It depends on what layout you use. I don't use layouts, but I've seen lots and lots in various books and websites, ranging from a simple right-to-left past-present-future to full tarot-style Celtic-Cross to 24-rune concentric circle year-ahead spreads. So there's no 'correct' answer to this.

                      I think what's important is to find the system that gets you the clearest interpretation. How it's done doesn't really matter... as long as it gets you the results. At the end of the day we don't even know whether the runes were ever used for divination historically... the only references we have to divination in our Northern ancestors refers to 'certain signs' and never uses the term 'rune' at all. So no one can argue what the 'correct' or 'ancient' way to read runes was... because we don't know it!
                      Thanks. I'm learning that a lot of this is upg... as you said we don't know what the ancestors actually did. So much is reconned. I think you are right about what works for us as individuals. After all, we should have a connection to our runes, and feel the right way of working with them. Yes, we likes this approach.
                      śivāya vishnu rūpaya śivaḥ rūpaya vishnave
                      śivasya hridayam viṣṇur viṣṇoscha hridayam śivaḥ

                      Comment

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