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Running into quite a few on-line Heathens who are quite immature and nasty

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    #31
    Re: Running into quite a few on-line Heathens who are quite immature and nasty

    I agree with just about everything said. If I don't agree it's because I don't have an opinion on it. 😜 I especially agree that people need to do more searching and learning on their own. And I can understand not wanting to hand-hold. I like to think that by the time I ask something it's because I really can't find the answers. I think I can say the same about almost everyone that comes here. I'd rather not answer if I think it's something that can easily be looked up than rip the person apart. If I know where the answer is I'll post the link. But again, the only sites I've found that are knowledgeable and courteous are here and my other site.
    śivāya vishnu rūpaya śivaḥ rūpaya vishnave
    śivasya hridayam viṣṇur viṣṇoscha hridayam śivaḥ

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      #32
      Re: Running into quite a few on-line Heathens who are quite immature and nasty

      As most have already posted, unfortunately, we find the same scenario spread far and wide in neopaganism. Who's way is the right way....Who knows more....

      I once had a 'witch' on FB slam me for disagreeing with her, to the point that she called me disrespectful because of the way I spoke to a 'High Priestess'....well, needless to say that didn't end well. :P

      Over many years, I've learned to navigate the neopagan community in a way that supports my own spirituality, and simply move along when people become unkind, based on nothing more than their own perceived superiority.

      It seems to me that it is they who have a lot of learning to do.
      Allow me to lend a machete to your intellectual thicket. ~ Captain Jack Sparrow

      sigpic

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        #33
        Re: Running into quite a few on-line Heathens who are quite immature and nasty

        Originally posted by cesara View Post
        It seems to me that it is they who have a lot of learning to do.
        Booyah!!! ::
        śivāya vishnu rūpaya śivaḥ rūpaya vishnave
        śivasya hridayam viṣṇur viṣṇoscha hridayam śivaḥ

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          #34
          Re: Running into quite a few on-line Heathens who are quite immature and nasty

          Originally posted by monsno_leedra View Post
          Bolded mine.

          I know from personal preference and experience that a lot of times the so called easy to answer and simple questions will get a person slammed rather fast. Yet most times it has nothing to do with the question as much as the it's been answered over and over and a little bit of searching the site would actually have answered it. Yet instead of searching or seeing if it's already been discussed before it gets asked yet again.

          LET ME PREFERENCE THIS WITH "YOU" IS USED COLLECTIVELY VICE DIRECTED AT THE INDIVIDUAL IN THE FOLLOWING!

          I'd add that the attitude of not answering if you don't know them is actually rather common as well. Knowing may be anything from actually knowing the person to knowing them via their own line persona and presence. I know myself I will hesitate to answer a lot of newbie questions simply because I do not have a feel for a person. Many times going so far as to dig up old entries they have made to get an idea of who they are, what their interest might be, how they view things and even what pathway they verbally seem to align with. Figure there are still a lot of people who take responsibility for what they say and how it might be presumed to mean. In the modern era even many still who hold their oaths of silence or only speaking around a subject or very limited about it.

          One thing does intrigue me though is the attitude of "People owe them something", especially in the sense of aiding them in bettering themselves. Realistically they owe you nothing when you consider the system is designed for the individual and individual enlightenment vice a group with no group based dogma. Especially so under the self dedication and initiation beliefs that rose up from neo-Wicca and outside of the lineage & initiation practices. Those groups who do have lineages, initiations and group dogma still owe you nothing as the oaths are to the group and it's meaning not to some unknown person on the net. Lets face it you can't have it both ways. You can't expect to claim it's an individual choice and pathwalk when it suits you then claim others have a responsibility to aid you in bettering yourself when you hit a personal inpass or dark night of the soul type situation.

          Nor can the collective you expect that those who came before have some implied expectation to give you anything they have discovered about themselves, their pathways or even how they interrelate to their own divine relationships. Figure it might have taken years to get where they are and it can be offensive to assume they are supposed to share that experience, knowledge, etc simply because the seeker appears to lazy to dedicate the time and effort themselves to discover it.

          In this instance it was a simple question. It was also over 5 years ago so the specifics of it don't come to mind. Also I want to reiterate I was not the new person who had asked the question but I did take offense. Keeping information to ones self is also a personal choice that I don't mind either but the problem I took with it was the person went to the trouble to say I have an answer but I refuse to answer you. Lets look here for example, if a new person posts a thread, and its something we have already going, someone generally responds with a link and politely says "hey read this first."

          I also don't see the point of withholding information. I don't think it has anything to do with being lazy. I work in an environment where thinking quickly and using your resources will keep you out of trouble. Work smarter not harder. Obviously there are some things that cannot be taught but I am not going to keep something to myself when I can help someone who is looking to expand on their spiritual knowledge. Just like I don't leave my new cooks by themselves on a busy night.
          "If you want to know what a man is like, take a good look at how he treats his inferiors, not his equals." -- Sirius Black

          "Time is an illusion, lunch time doubly so."-- Ford Prefect

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            #35
            Re: Running into quite a few on-line Heathens who are quite immature and nasty

            Originally posted by kalynraye View Post
            In this instance it was a simple question. It was also over 5 years ago so the specifics of it don't come to mind. Also I want to reiterate I was not the new person who had asked the question but I did take offense. Keeping information to ones self is also a personal choice that I don't mind either but the problem I took with it was the person went to the trouble to say I have an answer but I refuse to answer you. Lets look here for example, if a new person posts a thread, and its something we have already going, someone generally responds with a link and politely says "hey read this first."

            I also don't see the point of withholding information. I don't think it has anything to do with being lazy. I work in an environment where thinking quickly and using your resources will keep you out of trouble. Work smarter not harder. Obviously there are some things that cannot be taught but I am not going to keep something to myself when I can help someone who is looking to expand on their spiritual knowledge. Just like I don't leave my new cooks by themselves on a busy night.
            I'd disagree to the extent that you give them a piece of knowledge but no experience to go with it. Sorry have seen that hang far to many people out to dry because they were given an answer but never had the failures and minor successes to go with it. In many ways the old story of it took person A years to perfect it, they give the recipe to person B and it fails them in the long run because they didn't have the experience to identify and recognize all the aspects that go into the thing.

            Regarding looking for a thread and telling them to look here, they should of been doing that themselves before even asking. It's that experience and success and failure that builds the foundations. Not doing it for them and saying hey look here.

            Consider your avatar write up says your Celtic Pagan. Ok then I should be able to assume you know it's a language group not a people and as a language group it's broken down into P and Q specifics. Even potentially that what most pass off for Celtic is actually Irish Celtic and not reflective of what is found in mainland Europe. So if your asking about the Celtic people's that a big clue you don't know it's a language group and not a specific tribe or peoples such as say The Britons of England. Yet it should be safe to assume you'd have most of that basic knowledge already because you've researched it yourself.
            I'm Only Responsible For What I Say Not For What Or How You Understand!

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              #36
              Re: Running into quite a few on-line Heathens who are quite immature and nasty

              i dont't see the point in witholding information either... "hey I know the answer but won't tell you" is a dick move reserved for the "neener neener neener" sort of kid in the 2nd grade. If you still engage in that sort of thing as an adult, you need help. If you know the answer and don't feel like answering--totally understandable. l that way quite often for verious reasons, the proper response is "hey, try looking _____________" (enter thread, book, website etc" or just don't post in the damn thread!

              but while I don't believe in witholding information, lets face it, there aren't many life or death love spell requests or requests to help find a parton deity... directing someone on how to find something on their own rather than handing them the ritual I spent 3 weeks researching for, writing and adapting to my style of worship and belief , geting materials for, setting up and performing is honestly better for them in the short and long term (because I don't do cookie cutter).

              there has to be a balance. I get that new people are often lost at where to start and who to trust. honestly, the net is both a bane and a blessing...never has so much info been instantly available (when I started out, it was half a shelf in the back corner of waldenbooks, and two books 2 the library), but its like going to a buffet...where the hell do you start? Plus, in the long term, people don't appreciate what they get for free. You can be helpful without being an ass AND without bending over backwards...and if you can't, then move on to the next thread.
              Wonderful Life: The Burgess Shale and the Nature of HistoryPagan Devotionals, because the wind and the rain is our Bible
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                #37
                Re: Running into quite a few on-line Heathens who are quite immature and nasty



                I think each community has its own way of doing things, and unfortunately most online groups allow/encourage asshattery to flourish. But don't despair! Not all online communities are like this. I am part of a great roleplaying online community (through which I met my husband 12 years ago) and another FB community that evolved from a fan base for an advice columnist. From what I can tell so far, this is another great community.

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                  #38
                  Re: Running into quite a few on-line Heathens who are quite immature and nasty

                  Aw shucks, thanks. *kicks ground boyishly* After all the comments I realize it's not me, I'm not alone. And for that I am grateful. It's made me feel a lot better and a lot more confident and secure in my practice and relationship with the gods, spirits and ancestors.
                  śivāya vishnu rūpaya śivaḥ rūpaya vishnave
                  śivasya hridayam viṣṇur viṣṇoscha hridayam śivaḥ

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                    #39
                    Re: Running into quite a few on-line Heathens who are quite immature and nasty

                    Woot! Good on you! Now, get on with being awesome!
                    Allow me to lend a machete to your intellectual thicket. ~ Captain Jack Sparrow

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                      #40
                      Re: Running into quite a few on-line Heathens who are quite immature and nasty

                      Already on it!
                      śivāya vishnu rūpaya śivaḥ rūpaya vishnave
                      śivasya hridayam viṣṇur viṣṇoscha hridayam śivaḥ

                      Comment


                        #41
                        Re: Running into quite a few on-line Heathens who are quite immature and nasty

                        The Internet is kinda like opening Pandora's Box: You run into a bunch of bad ideas before you finally get to the good ones. And even then; you can't be sure if they are really "good" or not. It's all up to how you feel about it. I've been in many situations where I got called every name in the book by "older more experienced witches and pagans" because i disagreed with something or asked a question.

                        It's like it went from quick information access to an online popularity contest of "who's the better Pagan/Witch/Insert Religion here". It's sad really.

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                          #42
                          Re: Running into quite a few on-line Heathens who are quite immature and nasty

                          Originally posted by Akaichou View Post
                          I've been in many situations where I got called every name in the book by "older more experienced witches and pagans" because i disagreed with something or asked a question.

                          It's like it went from quick information access to an online popularity contest of "who's the better Pagan/Witch/Insert Religion here". It's sad really.
                          I wonder where they get all this experience and knowledge. It's not like these are long unbroken lines of practices passed down from generation to generation. They rail against and dismiss upg and woo-woo, but are they not using their own upg? I think the answer is a resounding "yes, they are". Given that I also think there is a healthy dose of Dunning-Kruger effect:

                          T
                          There's more to the effect, but I think that sums up the behavior of those we've encountered. I think the next time we run into any of these types we should just say "Much Dunning-Kruger effect?" and watch the shit really hit the fan.
                          śivāya vishnu rūpaya śivaḥ rūpaya vishnave
                          śivasya hridayam viṣṇur viṣṇoscha hridayam śivaḥ

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