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Are Germanic deities distant?

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    #16
    Re: Are Germanic deities distant?

    Dark night of the soul issues, yeha.....
    I'm Only Responsible For What I Say Not For What Or How You Understand!

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      #17
      Re: Are Germanic deities distant?

      Originally posted by monsno_leedra View Post
      Dark night of the soul issues, yeha.....
      It felt like an option to add. Not betting on its relevance here because one is generally on a path for a while before that joy comes along but it pops up occasionally and it felt like something to add.
      life itself was a lightsaber in his hands; even in the face of treachery and death and hopes gone cold, he burned like a candle in the darkness. Like a star shining in the black eternity of space.

      Yoda: Dark Rendezvous

      "But those men who know anything at all about the Light also know that there is a fierceness to its power, like the bare sword of the law, or the white burning of the sun." Suddenly his voice sounded to Will very strong, and very Welsh. "At the very heart, that is. Other things, like humanity, and mercy, and charity, that most good men hold more precious than all else, they do not come first for the Light. Oh, sometimes they are there; often, indeed. But in the very long run the concern of you people is with the absolute good, ahead of all else..."

      John Rowlands, The Grey King by Susan Cooper

      "You come from the Lord Adam and the Lady Eve", said Aslan. "And that is both honour enough to erect the head of the poorest beggar, and shame enough to bow the shoulders of the greatest emperor on earth; be content."

      Aslan, Prince Caspian by CS Lewis


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        #18
        Re: Are Germanic deities distant?

        Originally posted by MaskedOne View Post
        It felt like an option to add. Not betting on its relevance here because one is generally on a path for a while before that joy comes along but it pops up occasionally and it felt like something to add.
        Don't disagree at all. What makes it even worse is one might go through it multiple times in my opinion.
        I'm Only Responsible For What I Say Not For What Or How You Understand!

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          #19
          Re: Are Germanic deities distant?

          Originally posted by Ahvoo View Post
          You make a good point. I don't know, maybe I am looking in the wrong direction when it comes to deities and maybe the Nordic/Saxon pantheon is not for me but the way I think is if we put in the work such as setting up an altar, giving regular offerings etc. and we get next to nothing out of it, what is the point to it all? Aren't we just wasting time, money and energy?
          Basically, what Masked One said.

          There doesn't have to be a tangible benefit to your relationship... sometimes it's little things; sometimes it's things that you don't think of as being divine help (such as the examples Monsno gave); sometimes it's the lessons you learn in order to improve yourself; sometimes it's the tools you need to help yourself; sometimes it's simply the feeling that you get when you reach a genuine connection with your deity as opposed to the Divine Answering Machine.

          I understand the reasoning that if you're putting in the effort and not getting anything, why bother... but I think that's such a simplistic and shallow way to look at it. But then again, deity work is not for everyone and I've always believed that not everyone needs to have a 'patron' deity or worship deities at all. Sometimes what you're looking for is better found elsewhere... say with Ancestor work or simply improving your own skills. Sometimes I think pagans have unrealistic expectations of their deities, which can lead to a lot of dissatisfaction. So maybe before you decide whether the Northern pantheon is responding or not, you should first decide what your expectations are and work from there.

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            #20
            Re: Are Germanic deities distant?

            Originally posted by monsno_leedra View Post
            Don't disagree at all. What makes it even worse is one might go through it multiple times in my opinion.
            I can't think of a good argument against this premise and that disturbs me more than a little. My day was better thinking of that trial as a one shot deal.
            life itself was a lightsaber in his hands; even in the face of treachery and death and hopes gone cold, he burned like a candle in the darkness. Like a star shining in the black eternity of space.

            Yoda: Dark Rendezvous

            "But those men who know anything at all about the Light also know that there is a fierceness to its power, like the bare sword of the law, or the white burning of the sun." Suddenly his voice sounded to Will very strong, and very Welsh. "At the very heart, that is. Other things, like humanity, and mercy, and charity, that most good men hold more precious than all else, they do not come first for the Light. Oh, sometimes they are there; often, indeed. But in the very long run the concern of you people is with the absolute good, ahead of all else..."

            John Rowlands, The Grey King by Susan Cooper

            "You come from the Lord Adam and the Lady Eve", said Aslan. "And that is both honour enough to erect the head of the poorest beggar, and shame enough to bow the shoulders of the greatest emperor on earth; be content."

            Aslan, Prince Caspian by CS Lewis


            Comment


              #21
              Re: Are Germanic deities distant?

              Originally posted by monsno_leedra View Post
              Don't disagree at all. What makes it even worse is one might go through it multiple times in my opinion.
              I hate that Dark Night of the Soul thing.
              Every moment of a life is a horrible tragedy, a slapstick comedy, dark nihilism, golden illumination, or nothing at all; depending on how we write the story we tell ourselves.

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                #22
                Re: Are Germanic deities distant?

                Originally posted by B. de Corbin View Post
                I hate that Dark Night of the Soul thing.
                Me, too... and the odds are it's not just a one-off...
                I often wish that I had done drugs in the '70s. At least there'd be a reason for the flashbacks. - Rick the Runesinger

                Blood and CountryTribe of my Tribe
                Clan of my Clan
                Kin of my Kin
                Blood of my Blood



                For the Yule was upon them, the Yule; and they quaffed from the skulls of the slain,
                And shouted loud oaths in hoarse wit, and long quaffing swore laughing again.

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                  #23
                  Re: Are Germanic deities distant?

                  Originally posted by Ahvoo View Post
                  the gods I am interested in for the most part are Thor, Frigg, Sif and Tiwaz if that helps anybody. I've got to be honest I dislike micromanaging by anybody, not just deities so that's fine by me. Having said that however I do like deities who will at least assist you in your life to a degree, otherwise I think, what's the point?
                  I have worked with Thor, and in my experience, he has been very friendly, and does not micromanage. I wouldn't necessarily call him "distant," because he was very helpful, but he WAS only there for a short period of time. (it kind of depends on what your definition of distant is, I guess.)

                  Thor showed up when I needed him, was very friendly, helped me out, and then left when I didn't need him anymore after the issue had been resolved.

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                    #24
                    Re: Are Germanic deities distant?

                    This is the only way I can describe my experience thus far

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                      #25
                      Re: Are Germanic deities distant?

                      Originally posted by Ahvoo View Post
                      For those who work with Norse/Germanic deities, do you often feel that the gods are quite distant, uncaring and unapproachable? I have an interest in Germanic gods and goddesses and this is something I have heard about quite a bit by a few others who honor them. Is this your experience?
                      I can only speak on my personal experience. I fine that Holle is very present but I often do many things around my home with her in mind. She is a goddess of the home and homemaking. She also is in my thoughts when making offerings to my wights. She is also who I look to when doing and planning my spells. Other gods in the pantheon I feel nothing for and don't expect them to show up. Odin and Thor are really the only other gods I offer too and there have been times I certainly felt their influence. That said they are not hand holders. I find more often than not my dead are who I call on for help, issues, guidance and general spiritual advice.

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                        #26
                        Re: Are Germanic deities distant?

                        I worship Celtic and Norse deities. I wouldn't say that the Norse are distant or uncaring they just don't micromanage like Rick said. They let things unfold and are there if their worshipers have need of them but one thing I've noticed from studying history is that the Norse peoples were very self-sufficient in day to day life. Yes, they prayed and/or asked for help, but for the most part they took care of themselves and looked at the ability to do so as a gift from the gods.
                        (user formerly known as beckly_freckly)

                        You are a little soul carrying around a corpse.

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                          #27
                          Re: Are Germanic deities distant?

                          Just an aside though but one thing that always used to stick out to me was the Nordic and Teutonic edda's and sagga's always seemed to suggest ones fate was written at birth and it couldn't be changed. As such why worry about things you couldn't change nor call upon the gods / goddesses to try and change it. I suppose one might try to live well and proper to raise it but you'd not want to dwell on it and do things outside the norm for fear of possibly worsening it.
                          I'm Only Responsible For What I Say Not For What Or How You Understand!

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                            #28
                            Re: Are Germanic deities distant?

                            Originally posted by RowanModig View Post
                            I worship Celtic and Norse deities. I wouldn't say that the Norse are distant or uncaring they just don't micromanage like Rick said. They let things unfold and are there if their worshipers have need of them but one thing I've noticed from studying history is that the Norse peoples were very self-sufficient in day to day life. Yes, they prayed and/or asked for help, but for the most part they took care of themselves and looked at the ability to do so as a gift from the gods.
                            I agree with this wholeheartedly.

                            Adding: I think the idea of micromanaging is an Abrahamic one. Even the Hindu gods don't micromanage or interfere. I once heard in reference to the Hindu deities that they really don't pay attention and you have to almost scream and stamp your feet to get their attention. I think maybe the same can be said for the Norse deities. I think that like family members, they are there when you need them, and they may occasionally call you up on the phone, but they don't spend all their time with each of us. They have big things to do, and not being omnipotent or omniscient, they can't be with each of us 24/7/365. When something goes very wrong for me I don't attribute it to the gods not caring. When things go very right, more than I think they should given circumstances, I usually attribute it to some deity's help. On the other hand it could simply be wyrd or karma unfolding.

                            - - - Updated - - -

                            Originally posted by monsno_leedra View Post
                            Just an aside though but one thing that always used to stick out to me was the Nordic and Teutonic edda's and sagga's always seemed to suggest ones fate was written at birth and it couldn't be changed. As such why worry about things you couldn't change nor call upon the gods / goddesses to try and change it. I suppose one might try to live well and proper to raise it but you'd not want to dwell on it and do things outside the norm for fear of possibly worsening it.
                            That's the idea of orlog and wyrd, and it's not totally unlike karma. While it's true that the tapestry of wyrd is for the most part spun - the analogy usually used - it's not totally unchangeable. Threads can be removed, threads can be added. The basic fabric and design is there, but little flourishes can change. According to Teutonic Magic (Gundarsson Kveldorf) Germanic understanding of time has only two states, the past and that which is becoming. There is no future as we today understand it. So what is becoming can actually be changed to a degree. But I think the gods would have to have a damn good overriding reason to make any kind of major change to one's wyrd, if they can or do at all.
                            śivāya vishnu rūpaya śivaḥ rūpaya vishnave
                            śivasya hridayam viṣṇur viṣṇoscha hridayam śivaḥ

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                              #29
                              Re: Are Germanic deities distant?

                              Originally posted by Thorbjorn View Post
                              .. That's the idea of orlog and wyrd, and it's not totally unlike karma. While it's true that the tapestry of wyrd is for the most part spun - the analogy usually used - it's not totally unchangeable. Threads can be removed, threads can be added. The basic fabric and design is there, but little flourishes can change. According to Teutonic Magic (Gundarsson Kveldorf) Germanic understanding of time has only two states, the past and that which is becoming. There is no future as we today understand it. So what is becoming can actually be changed to a degree. But I think the gods would have to have a damn good overriding reason to make any kind of major change to one's wyrd, if they can or do at all.
                              That pretty much matches what I was thinking. Small threads can be changed but the totality of the tapestry is already laid. Sorry been to long since I really delved into the Norns and the tapestry stories. Just recall human or god / goddess didn't matter as the Norns weaved the fate of all.
                              I'm Only Responsible For What I Say Not For What Or How You Understand!

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                                #30
                                Re: Are Germanic deities distant?

                                I'm pretty sure what I'm going to say has already been said, but I feel the matter largerly revolves around how influenced you are by the pathway itself. If you do your workings daily, and run your life in their way of thinking, you shall see a bigger presence from the Gods. If you are distant with them, they shall be distant with you. But the Norse Dieties are not like any other religious sect I've come across. You don't pray for betterment in norse culture, you act better for yourself, and good tides shall come. Nothing will happen if you don't make it happen, and if you aren't trying, but just praying, these things are a long shot. For every action needs a positive action to start a cycle, just as in magic workings. I can't pray to my Gods to fix my life, and wait to see if it works. I go out, and do things necessary for myself to the best ability I can, and when they happen, I am proud of not only myself, but of my Gods for helping me get to that point.
                                I am very close with my deities. I give offerings to Odin daily, as well to Loki. I feel them guide my hand, and come to my aid mentally and psychically when need be, but they will not do anything for me unless I start a reaction, doing things for myself. My own two cents.
                                "In the shade now tall forms are advancing,
                                And their wan hands like snowflakes in the moonlight are gleaming;
                                They beckon, they whisper, 'Oh! strong armed in valor,
                                The pale guests await thee - mead foams in Valhalla.'"
                                - Finn's Saga

                                http://hoodednorseman.tumblr.com/

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