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Thread: How do you have it all?

  1. #1
    Supporter kalynraye's Avatar
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    How do you have it all?

    I watched a video last night that was of Mark Canlis at Roots of American Food, its about taking care of those that work in the hospitality industry. His ideas are mind blowing to me, and completely inspiring. If I could I would pack up everything we owned and move us to Seattle to work for this man.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=au1fe9p67wc&sns=fb

    And from this video its brought a lot of questions to the light that I and the women I work with have. Five years ago when I started at the hotel three of us formed a friendship that has lasted. In the last year we have all gotten married and two of the three of us have bought houses, and it seems the next step is babies. We all three want them but with them comes lots of other responsibilities and hard decisions.

    We are at points where we want to spend time with our spouses and take care of our homes. We don't want to spend 10-12 hours a day at work but we also don't want to give up what we've worked for. I love working dinner service. I love working dinner service on the weekends. I love that adrenaline, that fire, and I love when I have truly made someones dinner something special. It doesn't happen all the time but every now and then it blows my mind to have a guest walk up to our line (were an open kitchen) and say "Hey Chefs, dinner was great and you guys are doing an amazing job! Or when a server comes up to me and goes "Hey will you wave at 302 you made their dinner tonight and they loved watching you, its the best Salmon they have ever had."

    So how do we have it all? How do you have it all? The time to spend at home, to raise your kids (or furrykids) to maintain your home. To keep your relationships going and still have a successful career? Because I don't want to give up my career. I don't want to give up all that I have worked for but I don't want to get a divorce 5,10,15 years down the road because my job took prescience over my relationship with my husband.

    And we've pondered this a lot lately it seems. Sometimes to ourselves and sometimes with each other. If I'm going to have kids I want to be a part of their raising. I don't want a Nanny to do it but from what I've seen I have to sacrifice something. I either give up that time with my husband and kids for that career or I give up that career...

    They are hard questions for me and I feel there are no easy answers. I want it all and to eat my cake too but I don't know how to accomplish it.
    "If you want to know what a man is like, take a good look at how he treats his inferiors, not his equals." -- Sirius Black

    "Time is an illusion, lunch time doubly so."-- Ford Prefect

  2. #2
    sea witch thalassa's Avatar
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    Re: How do you have it all?

    So how do we have it all? How do you have it all? The time to spend at home, to raise your kids (or furrykids) to maintain your home. To keep your relationships going and still have a successful career?
    You can't. The idea that you can have it all is a myth. Maybe if you are independently wealthy or married tosomeone that is independently wealthy...but you can't have it all. You can either have one or two things all the way or you can have everything a little bit. But you will always have to give up a little to have a piece of everything.
    “You have never answered but you did not need to. If I stand at the ocean I can hear you with your thousand voices. Sometimes you shout, hilarious laughter that taunts all questions. Other nights you are silent as death, a mirror in which the stars show themselves. Then I think you want to tell me something, but you never do. Of course I know I have written letters to no-one. But what if I find a trident tomorrow?" ~~Letters to Poseidon, Cees Nooteboom

    “We still carry this primal relationship to the Earth within our consciousness, even if we have long forgotten it. It is a primal recognition of the wonder, beauty, and divine nature of the Earth. It is a felt reverence for all that exists. Once we bring this foundational quality into our consciousness, we will be able to respond to our present man-made crisis from a place of balance, in which our actions will be grounded in an attitude of respect for all of life. This is the nature of real sustainability.”
    ~~Llewellyn Vaughan-Lee

    "We are the offspring of history, and must establish our own paths in this most diverse and interesting of conceivable universes--one indifferent to our suffering, and therefore offering us maximal freedom to thrive, or to fail, in our own chosen way."
    ~~Stephen Jay Gould, Wonderful Life: The Burgess Shale and the Nature of History

    "Humans are not rational creatures. Now, logic and rationality are very helpful tools, but there’s also a place for embracing our subjectivity and thinking symbolically. Sometimes what our so-called higher thinking can’t or won’t see, our older, more primitive intuition will." John Beckett

    Pagan Devotionals, because the wind and the rain is our Bible

  3. #3
    Member Nue's Avatar
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    Re: How do you have it all?

    Even if you did have it all, image the level of stress you may end up getting from just trying to -maintain- it all!

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    Supporter kalynraye's Avatar
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    Re: How do you have it all?

    Lol in all honesty I deal with high stress situations every day so the stress doesn't bother me. What bothers me is being put in a put on lunch and never moving up because my availability has decreased so I can be home. That I am no longer considered worthy to work that line.

    I know I have to make sacrifices because I'm not nor is my husband independently wealthy but I am not keen on giving up so much. With the loss of hours I put in the likelihood I will be passed up on a promotion grows. Which could hurt us financially as well. I do want it all. I want a schedule that's flexible where I can be home more nights then I am now but still have the opportunity to work dinner service and not get passed up. I want to be able to raise my children and have a good relationship with my spouse.

    I don't know why I have to give it up when (and no offense intended) a man does not. Yes I have seen it, they are congratulated and patied on the back and then "new" positions become available because now they have to support a family now, and shifts are moved around so they get to spend time at home with their new family. But the last female line cook we had who became pregnant they encouraged not to come back. We don't want mothers in a kitchen. But father's we are all for.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Also forgive any typos I'm on my tablet and I'm sure there are plenty.

    - - - Updated - - -

    One more add, I know that some men do face the same dilemma, my Dad never moved up when he worked at the orange tool store because he was a single parent and had a very set schedule so he could be home to take care of us at night. But overall I feel there is a huge inequality in this.
    "If you want to know what a man is like, take a good look at how he treats his inferiors, not his equals." -- Sirius Black

    "Time is an illusion, lunch time doubly so."-- Ford Prefect

  5. #5
    lady sings the blues DanieMarie's Avatar
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    Re: How do you have it all?

    To be honest, I think you -can- have it all here, IF social support, work values, and all that jazz stay as they are. A 40-hour work week is still the norm here, and we get excellent benefits like parental leave, child support benefits, health care, etc.

    The problem is, work culture is getting too English. I won't single out one country, because they're all equally bad. When I moved here, people worked to live and productivity per hour was pretty impressive. People went to work, did there jobs, and then went home. There were a few workaholics, but their lifestyle was not considered the norm. Now, more and more people are spending longer and longer hours at work. Productivity per hour is dropping and there is no solid sign that any more work is coming out of these increased hours, and there are a lot of days lost due to things like stress, illness and burnout (thanks to paid sick leave, we at least still get that). But many companies just aren't seeing it. I think it partly comes down to sheer greed, and party due to the fact that there are more and more managers from English speaking countries here that think that's just normal (it's not....not here).

    Then again, there are enlightened businesses that allow job sharing, part-time work, flexible work, and sensible full time work hours, so there's hope. The government is trying to push those, because right now, the German job market needs workers and most policy makers realize that they're still losing a lot of women in the workforce. So, they want to encourage family-friendly work practices to keep people working.

    Due to the EU work time directive, employers aren't even supposed to have work hours longer than 48 hours a week. Unfortunately, it's not very strictly controlled. Still, I guess it's taken seriously to an extent. I know a few people who work a lot of hours, and because they're technically not supposed to, they always seem to be able to take extra holiday days (on top of the 24 paid working days - not total days - you already are legally entitled to).

    Anyway, I hope our rights stay protected, because I think it makes "having it all" pretty reachable (when "all" means a job, relationship, and family and not like a boat or huge house or something like that).

    That all being said, values are a lot different here. Most people don't really seem to care if they get super rich or successful. They just want a job that gives them a comfortable living, that they can leave at the end of the day.

  6. #6
    sea witch thalassa's Avatar
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    Re: How do you have it all?

    Quote Originally Posted by kalynraye View Post
    I know I have to make sacrifices because I'm not nor is my husband independently wealthy but I am not keen on giving up so much. With the loss of hours I put in the likelihood I will be passed up on a promotion grows. Which could hurt us financially as well. I do want it all. I want a schedule that's flexible where I can be home more nights then I am now but still have the opportunity to work dinner service and not get passed up. I want to be able to raise my children and have a good relationship with my spouse.

    I don't know why I have to give it up when (and no offense intended) a man does not.
    Men don't have it all either. They have their own set of cultural and societal expectations to live by too, when it comes to work and family. I know plenty of men that have been passed up because they put their family first. And plenty of men who no longer have a family that wants anything to do with them because they put work first.

    That's just part of life. You will always have to compromise or give something up to do something else. No one lives in a utopia where you don't have to make sacrifices. Sure, some jobs will let you have *more* of family time, etc...but (as they say in the Navy), "choose your rate (your job), choose your fate".

    And no matter what you do, there will always be things that happen that you can't reschedule or move to suit you---even when its something as simple as having to decide whether to missing a kid's recital because of a work confrence, or miss the work confrence for the kid's recital. I have great benefits (ample sick time and vacation time) and a job that I can take off just about whenever I need to and still get paid and I never work weekends or evenings and I only work 40 hours a week (no budget for overtime)...but sometimes stuff just has to get done. No matter how understanding my boss is (and he's pretty understanding since he wife was a teacher and he was the one that had to call in when the kids were sick during the school year), I can't take off every day that I want to to do something for or with my kids.

    This weekend I could have taken off to take the kids to see their dad, except that I have stuff to get done at work. So I have to wait til the 4th of July. My husband didn't *have* to go to Georgia for a month and then extend for another month, but they needed his expertise and he makes more money when he travels with overtime and per diem--which means more in the budget to fix my car's AC. Just yesterday, my babysitter went and took picutres of my daughter's honor roll assembly because I had to sample a job--its a job that only happens every couple months, and it had to be sampled quarterly because of safety regulations, and there wasn't anyone else to do it. Don't get me wrong, taking time off won't affect whether or not I get promoted, but if I want to do my job well, sometimes family has to be a second priority when there isn't an emergency.

    You chose a job that practically requires you to work according to your customer's demands if you want professional success...that's dinner. Probably lots of Friday and Sat nights. That means that you either figure out how to adjust your homelife (for future kids) accordingly (this is why some families homeschool) so you have time with them, or you accept that you can only advance so far at work. That's just life.
    “You have never answered but you did not need to. If I stand at the ocean I can hear you with your thousand voices. Sometimes you shout, hilarious laughter that taunts all questions. Other nights you are silent as death, a mirror in which the stars show themselves. Then I think you want to tell me something, but you never do. Of course I know I have written letters to no-one. But what if I find a trident tomorrow?" ~~Letters to Poseidon, Cees Nooteboom

    “We still carry this primal relationship to the Earth within our consciousness, even if we have long forgotten it. It is a primal recognition of the wonder, beauty, and divine nature of the Earth. It is a felt reverence for all that exists. Once we bring this foundational quality into our consciousness, we will be able to respond to our present man-made crisis from a place of balance, in which our actions will be grounded in an attitude of respect for all of life. This is the nature of real sustainability.”
    ~~Llewellyn Vaughan-Lee

    "We are the offspring of history, and must establish our own paths in this most diverse and interesting of conceivable universes--one indifferent to our suffering, and therefore offering us maximal freedom to thrive, or to fail, in our own chosen way."
    ~~Stephen Jay Gould, Wonderful Life: The Burgess Shale and the Nature of History

    "Humans are not rational creatures. Now, logic and rationality are very helpful tools, but there’s also a place for embracing our subjectivity and thinking symbolically. Sometimes what our so-called higher thinking can’t or won’t see, our older, more primitive intuition will." John Beckett

    Pagan Devotionals, because the wind and the rain is our Bible

  7. #7
    Supporter Hawkfeathers's Avatar
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    Re: How do you have it all?

    I guess I'm lucky in that I never wanted "it all". I was always childfree so I didn't have that as an issue. You hit the nail on the head here, though: - - - Updated - - -

    One more add, I know that some men do face the same dilemma, my Dad never moved up when he worked at the orange tool store because he was a single parent and had a very set schedule so he could be home to take care of us at night. But overall I feel there is a huge inequality in this.[/QUOTE]

    When I was going to grad school at night, suddenly my boss wanted me to stay late, on class nights. Starting with my 2nd semester, I told him the wrong nights, and no more conflict. They will do anything to keep control over you. It doesn't matter if you have a kid, an elderly parent, a 2nd job, or a dog that needs walking. They want your allegiance and availability. You are bringing money to them. That is their only use for you.

    The 1950's model of "the company man" was a married man whose only focus was his career. I was raised in that kind of home. My mother did everything pertaining to the house. There were basically 2 people working on 1 career. Dad didn't even have to pick out his clothes - they were laid out for him in the morning. (I wanted to be him when I grew up! ) This model most benefits the company, and it's still used today, in varying degrees.

    Can you hear me, Major Tom? I think I love you.

  8. #8
    Supporter Jembru's Avatar
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    Re: How do you have it all?

    It's a question I've mulled over a lot before. I too work in a job that only pays a comfortable wage because of the hours we work. Our hourly rate is pretty poor. 14 hour shifts are normal in my place (although my standard shift length is 10 hours because day shift starts at 8am and ends at 10pm). I have the option of picking up extra hours, and I probably work about 6-10 hours over on an average month. I could do more, but I already find that balancing a 'normal' life with the unusual work pattern is tough. If I were to work even more hours, I just couldn't enjoy what I'd worked for.

    Of course, it's further complicated by the fact that I support my mum who is long-term unemployed. A large chunk of what should be my disposable income goes to my mum every Friday, so I've had to make lifestyle sacrifices that I wouldn't otherwise have had to. It kinda sucks, and some days I really resent it. Which makes me angry at myself because it's not my mum's fault that the company she worked for went bust, or that employers judge her because of her age, health and duration of unemployment.

    So.. I've been looking into another line of work. I'm thinking of becoming an NVQ assessor for Health and Social care. I've explored the idea before and I'm more than qualified to do the job, but I was warned that it's not unusual to have 40-50 students on your books at any one time, and that if you don't drive, a disproportionate amount of time will be taken up with travelling to your student's places of work, making your workday impossibly long. The money is a few grand a year more than I have now, but my job has other benefits, like being very relaxed, allowing me time to study Japanese, meditate, and do yoga, all while on shift, meaning I can spend less of those precious hours outside of work, on those pursuits.

    So.. for now, I think I am better off where I am. I don't have it all, by any stretch, but it seems right for the time being. Once my mum sells her flat (which can't happen until her dog passes away), she'll be able to pay off her dept, move into rented accommodation that she'll get government support for, so I won't have to give her money anymore. I'll be able to afford to learn to drive, get a car.. then take that NVQ Assessors job, working from home, managing my own schedule.. being able to earn a better salary... Assuming I haven't thought of something I can do without a car by then. I bloomin' hate cars and never wanted to drive. I've always felt kinda smug that having a simple life, no car and being vegetarian made my carbon footprint tiny compared to your average Brit. I'd miss those bragging rights.

    But for now nothing will change until Oscar dies, and he's well cared for, so this rut could continue for years yet...
    夕方に急なにわか雨は「夕立」と呼ばれるなら、なぜ朝ににわか雨は「朝立ち」と呼ばれないの? ^^If a sudden rain shower in the evening is referred to as an 'evening stand', then why isn't a shower in the morning called 'morning stand'?

  9. #9
    lady sings the blues DanieMarie's Avatar
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    Re: How do you have it all?

    ^^

    Y'know, though, there are some situations where it's justifiable to drive, and having to travel from place to place throughout the day is one of those. I hope it works out for you!

  10. #10
    Newbie ancienttrees's Avatar
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    Re: How do you have it all?

    Iv been working 84 to 93 hours a week seven days a week for a few years now, doing two jobs. The only reason is to hit goals quickly so we can build the life we want faster. So since November it was for our handfasting and next month its for our house deposit. Then Il drop down to more sane hours. I wouldn't recommend it but it works, and these days I don't think any jobs safe. I do scratch my head at what other twenty odd year olds are doing but I guess Iv grown up quicker. I did watch a documentary on youtube I think it was called Without Bound perspectives on mobile living. I wasn't interested in mobile living but it really changed my thinking on the, 'always gona have the bigger tv or fancier car' idea. There's definitely an end point to ease working overtime and start seeking out adventure. Mental health, drugs, abuse etc effects the rich just as much, happiness can't be bought.

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