The destruction of history

[thalassa]

So...I think this is something we shouls be concerned about:

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/jul/03/antiquities-looted-by-isis-end-up-in-london-shops

[B. de Corbin]

Re: The destruction of history

So...I think this is something we shouls be concerned about:

http://www.theguardian.com/world/201...n-london-shops

It is sad that there are monied people who do not care where their money goes, provided they get what they want.

Sad, but not surprising.

Note: there are Chinese chemical companies exporting massive quantities of completely untested psychoactive "research chemicals" to Europe and America. Nothing surprises me anymore...

[anunitu]

Re: The destruction of history

In a strange way,maybe better they were smuggled out,and not destroyed..so in many ways at least the are still intact..

[B. de Corbin]

Re: The destruction of history

In a strange way,maybe better they were smuggled out,and not destroyed..so in many ways at least the are still intact..

The "value" of most of the artifacts is not in the things themselves, but in the archeological context in which they are found. Illegal excavations for sales to "collectors" destroys this context completely, meaning that all "meaning" of the artifact is lost forever, and can never, ever be recovered.

[anunitu]

Re: The destruction of history

So,a lose lose because they are turned into a money thing,and history and culture are tossed to the side because people only want a cool trinket...sigh..

[monsno_leedra]

Re: The destruction of history

Truthfully I think it's a little humorous in that people get upset that ISIS, or any group, is doing it to change their history or profit from it but see nothing wrong when it's done for instance in the US to change an aspect of history they dislike. In the historical record is any archaic site being destroyed in Syria any more or less important than the effort in the US to destroy Stone Mountain and it's historical importance? Both are records and testaments to a given period and the people who created them. Native American burial grounds are plundered quite frequently as are South and Central American cities, temples, etc.

I do agree though that illegal digs and such truly do destroy the complete picture and history of a place. Many objects today reside in museums that no one can tell you where it was found in relationship to the place it was supposedly taken from.

[anunitu]

Re: The destruction of history

This does remind me of an effort to Ban Tom Sawyer and Huck Finn because they contain words that remind us of the slavery years..I am really sorry,BUT these things did happen,and we should be reminded that they did. Trying to deny history is really a sad comment on our negative past,hiding it does not make it like it never happened.

[thalassa]

Re: The destruction of history

Truthfully I think it's a little humorous in that people get upset that ISIS, or any group, is doing it to change their history or profit from it but see nothing wrong when it's done for instance in the US to change an aspect of history they dislike. In the historical record is any archaic site being destroyed in Syria any more or less important than the effort in the US to destroy Stone Mountain and it's historical importance?

Who here has said that?

Although, I think a better example would be something created before 1972 to commemorate something that happened 100 years before that...otherwise we have a little tiny straw man problem with your analogy.

ETA: Something like...bulldozing Anasazi ruins for shopping malls would work. And that would make me equally mad.

[monsno_leedra]

Re: The destruction of history

Who here has said that?

Although, I think a better example would be something created before 1972 to commemorate something that happened 100 years before that...otherwise we have a little tiny straw man problem with your analogy.

ETA: Something like...bulldozing Anasazi ruins for shopping malls would work. And that would make me equally mad.

Didn't say anyone was only that it's how people tend to respond.

The second part of your statement goes back to the old adage that older is better and of more historical importance. Sorry comparing Stone Mountain and what ISIS is doing is a valid observation of cultural, social and historical influence and attitude towards it. It's the same lack of historical perspective and placing something into its historical period vice evaluating something based upon today's ethics, morality, culture, etc and saying if it is of worth or not.

Either way though for the majority of people it has nothing to do with the historical facet of the situation only that they are being feed the media and governmental perspective at a given point. ISIS is bad by our ethics, beliefs, etc so anything they do has to be bad and that bad will be focused upon. Not saying nor trying to imply anything about them is good but controlling and manipulating the masses and telling them what is bad is all about propaganda. This is all about propaganda more so than about antiquities being destroyed or sold off to the highest bidder.

[B. de Corbin]

Re: The destruction of history

I think beheading people for disagreement is bad. I don't need a gooberment to tell me that.

I'm funny that way.

[monsno_leedra]

Re: The destruction of history

I think beheading people for disagreement is bad. I don't need a gooberment to tell me that.

I'm funny that way.

But this one is not about beheading people its about selling artifacts and destroying something historical. Things that the majority of the population probably have no idea of what they are to begin with. So the article relies, in my opinion, upon the created hate and anger towards the group more than what the group is doing to antiquities. Other groups equally despoil burial sites, historic sites, etc and remove artifacts and you don't hear a word about it unless you move in certain groups.

[B. de Corbin]

Re: The destruction of history

But this one is not about beheading people its about selling artifacts and destroying something historical. Things that the majority of the population probably have no idea of what they are to begin with. So the article relies, in my opinion, upon the created hate and anger towards the group more than what the group is doing to antiquities. Other groups equally despoil burial sites, historic sites, etc and remove artifacts and you don't hear a word about it unless you move in certain groups.

Actually, anybody with even a tiny knowledge of archeology and a casual knowledge of the illegal trade in antiquities (which has been going on for a very long time), would find this appalling, not because of gooberment propaganda, but simply because he/she has been made aware of it.

Maybe my knowledge of art history makes me special, but I doubt it, since I've forgotten most of it, and just follow news...

[anunitu]

Re: The destruction of history

A picture comes to mind of the ISIS(Isil,what ever their name is now) grabs a kid for drawing a pic of Muhammad,even tough not sure who the pic is of..

- - - Updated - - -

Clearly kid is trying to make an image of said holy guy.

[Hawkfeathers]

Re: The destruction of history

I hate that the name Isis is besmirched by these terrorists.
All of this about artifacts makes me remember the Taliban destroying the Buddha statues. And we all know what they destroyed next. So none of this is to be taken in any way lightly.

[B. de Corbin]

Re: The destruction of history

A picture comes to mind of the ISIS(Isil,what ever their name is now)...

Take your pic. I pick ISIL because I like Isis.

...grabs a kid for drawing a pic of Muhammad,even tough not sure who the pic is of..

The goal of terrorism is terror. Truth, justice, kindness, etc., do not matter to the terrorist, as long as the goal is achieved. It is a means of control, and a very shitty one, and that is ALL it is.