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    Re: They are willing to destroy this country

    Originally posted by Denarius View Post
    Do you have any information I don't that says that women or motorists use significantly more tax dollars than they put in the system?
    https://www.cdc.gov/teenpregnancy/about/ None of these mothers, being teenagers, could possibly have put a lot into the system by the time they incurred the costs associated with childbirth. The number of teenaged males doing this is, of course, zero.

    I'm not going to search for statistics on motor vehicle accident costs incurred by non-drivers, and how that stacks up next to those with licenses, but you can if you want to.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Originally posted by Denarius View Post
    Do you have any information I don't that says that women or motorists use significantly more tax dollars than they put in the system?
    https://www.cdc.gov/teenpregnancy/about/ None of these mothers, being teenagers, could possibly have put a lot into the system by the time they incurred the costs associated with childbirth. The number of teenaged males doing this is, of course, zero.

    I'm not going to search for statistics on motor vehicle accident costs incurred by non-drivers, and how that stacks up next to those with licenses, but you can if you want to.
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      Re: They are willing to destroy this country

      Originally posted by Hawkfeathers View Post
      https://www.cdc.gov/teenpregnancy/about/ None of these mothers, being teenagers, could possibly have put a lot into the system by the time they incurred the costs associated with childbirth.
      Not even one tenth the tax burden. $9.1B a year for teen motherhood compared to $113B a year for illegal immigration.

      That's not even getting into how much they take out of the system vs how much they pay into it, in their lifetime. I couldn't find anything on teen mothers, but Illegal immigrants pay twenty times less into the system than average.

      Given the significant disparity in the amount they are costing the system, there'd have to be an equally significant disparity in the amount they are putting into the system in order for it to be comparable. Though, even if they paid nothing back into the system, ever, the burden is still significantly higher for immigration.
      Last edited by Denarius; 28 Mar 2017, 13:20.
      Trust is knowing someone or something well enough to have a good idea of their motivations and character, for good or for ill. People often say trust when they mean faith.

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        Re: They are willing to destroy this country

        Denarius, the entire population of the US is the result of immigration. You are all bloody immigrants, just about. Including most of the people in government. Even if you can go back centuries, the chances are that one's ancestors came over on a ship and set up camp in north america. They certainly weren't invited by the original peoples. (And I'm not picking on you or the US - same goes for the UK and Europe).

        Maybe you are a member of the First Nations, fair enough if you are. But then you should be raving at all these other 'illegals' who have come over during the past few centuries as 'illegals' too. And the source you gave for what illegals are presently costing is more than a little skewed. I mean the very title, The Federation for American Immgration Reform is a bit of unwitting testimony regarding their agenda.
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          Re: They are willing to destroy this country

          My people are the 'they' of this administration.
          Just wait until it's you.

          Just.Wait.
          Satan is my spirit animal

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            Re: They are willing to destroy this country

            I agree...when that iron ball rolls,it eventually rolls over everyone.
            MAGIC is MAGIC,black OR white or even blood RED

            all i ever wanted was a normal life and love.
            NO TERF EVER WE belong Too.
            don't stop the tears.let them flood your soul.




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              Re: They are willing to destroy this country

              Originally posted by Denarius View Post
              Not even one tenth the tax burden. $9.1B a year for teen motherhood compared to $113B a year for illegal immigration.
              Illegal immigration makes money for the economy overall.


              Wonderful Life: The Burgess Shale and the Nature of HistoryPagan Devotionals, because the wind and the rain is our Bible
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                Re: They are willing to destroy this country

                Originally posted by Tylluan Penry View Post
                Maybe you are a member of the First Nations, fair enough if you are. But then you should be raving at all these other 'illegals' who have come over during the past few centuries as 'illegals' too.
                I'm biracial, but that's also a good point about how unchecked immigration is dangerous and disruptive. Nowadays we have a system of legal immigration set up to insure that people aren't bringing diseases like the ones that almost wiped out the indigenous population and will integrate into our society instead of displace it with theirs.

                the source you gave for what illegals are presently costing is more than a little skewed. I mean the very title, The Federation for American Immgration Reform is a bit of unwitting testimony regarding their agenda.
                You disagree with their agenda, fine I can respect that, if you disagree with their findings then I'll need to see another source that says otherwise. Then we can have that discussion.

                Originally posted by Medusa View Post
                My people are the 'they' of this administration.
                Just wait until it's you.

                Just.Wait.
                My people, the rural working class, were the "they" of the last administration...and the one before that... and the one before that...

                Originally posted by thalassa View Post
                Illegal immigration makes money for the economy overall.
                However,many estimates also show that the cost of providingpublic services to unauthorized immigrants at the stateand local levels exceeds what that population pays in stateand local taxes.
                Very interesting how they didn't finish that quote from the article they sourced.

                Although Harvard economist Jorge Borjas has stated that illegal immigrants from 1980-2000 have reduced the wages of high school dropouts in the U.S, he also states that the average American’s wealth has increased by 1 percent because of illegal immigration
                At the expense of working class americans and legal immigrants.

                I know correlation does not imply causation, but there are some strong correlations with the massive increase in legal immigration from Mexico since the Immigration and Nationality Act of 1965 and the spike of illegal immigration that followed it.

                Though I can't possibly see how importing millions of unskilled laborers since the sixties has anything to do with the precipitous fall in demand for unskilled labor or the crumbling influence of the labor union.
                Trust is knowing someone or something well enough to have a good idea of their motivations and character, for good or for ill. People often say trust when they mean faith.

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                  Re: They are willing to destroy this country

                  One point that some seem to find hard to understand when it comes to Unskilled labor,and people wanting their "Jobs" back. Many jobs are GONE,and will never come back,the hand has writ,and moved on. I have read there are a LOT of jobs that go unfilled mainly because there is a lack of trained and educated people to fill them. It would be a VERY good idea for our Government to have an educational program as many other countries have. Germany as an example Companies seeking skilled workers can and should sponsor and back a system of training for the workers they seek. They could require that these trained workers "promise,as in contract" to work for the companies that sponsored their education. This might also apply to medicine..Covering the cost of training doctors,and having an obligation to work doing community clinics for their first 6-10 years and then go into private practice.

                  If we want a strong and prosperous country then we have an obligation to train up our workers,so we as a country can grow and surpass expectations we have as a leader in the world.
                  MAGIC is MAGIC,black OR white or even blood RED

                  all i ever wanted was a normal life and love.
                  NO TERF EVER WE belong Too.
                  don't stop the tears.let them flood your soul.




                  sigpic

                  my new page here,let me know what you think.


                  nothing but the shadow of what was

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                  http://www.witchvox.com/vu/vxposts.html

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                    Re: They are willing to destroy this country

                    Originally posted by Denarius View Post

                    Though I can't possibly see how importing millions of unskilled laborers since the sixties has anything to do with the precipitous fall in demand for unskilled labor or the crumbling influence of the labor union.

                    Automation.
                    Wonderful Life: The Burgess Shale and the Nature of HistoryPagan Devotionals, because the wind and the rain is our Bible
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                      Re: They are willing to destroy this country

                      Originally posted by thalassa View Post
                      Automation.
                      Interesting though that it only became an issue in the work force at the exact same time that illegal immigration started massively spiking. Jobs may be "gone" but there are sure a lot being filled by foreign nationals.

                      Last edited by Denarius; 29 Mar 2017, 12:40.
                      Trust is knowing someone or something well enough to have a good idea of their motivations and character, for good or for ill. People often say trust when they mean faith.

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                        Re: They are willing to destroy this country

                        Originally posted by anunitu View Post
                        One point that some seem to find hard to understand when it comes to Unskilled labor,and people wanting their "Jobs" back. Many jobs are GONE,and will never come back,the hand has writ,and moved on. I have read there are a LOT of jobs that go unfilled mainly because there is a lack of trained and educated people to fill them. It would be a VERY good idea for our Government to have an educational program as many other countries have. Germany as an example Companies seeking skilled workers can and should sponsor and back a system of training for the workers they seek. They could require that these trained workers "promise,as in contract" to work for the companies that sponsored their education. This might also apply to medicine..Covering the cost of training doctors,and having an obligation to work doing community clinics for their first 6-10 years and then go into private practice.

                        If we want a strong and prosperous country then we have an obligation to train up our workers,so we as a country can grow and surpass expectations we have as a leader in the world.
                        There used to be quite a few apprentice type programs in the US, many backed by major corporations. Even considering all the automation and such within many industries there are still many jobs that require skilled workers but those skilled workers are not to be found. Many of the technical schools that once existed have folded and many of the advanced apprentice schools are gone as well. Yet you still see many corporations using headhunters to seek out qualified people that they could grow both in-house and through their own apprentice programs. But that also costs dollars and that means trimming profit lines I think.
                        I'm Only Responsible For What I Say Not For What Or How You Understand!

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                          Re: They are willing to destroy this country

                          Point,profit may fall if said companies have no workers to create their products(Then they go to other countries to fulfill their needs)
                          MAGIC is MAGIC,black OR white or even blood RED

                          all i ever wanted was a normal life and love.
                          NO TERF EVER WE belong Too.
                          don't stop the tears.let them flood your soul.




                          sigpic

                          my new page here,let me know what you think.


                          nothing but the shadow of what was

                          witchvox
                          http://www.witchvox.com/vu/vxposts.html

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                            Re: They are willing to destroy this country

                            Originally posted by Denarius View Post
                            Interesting though that it only became an issue in the work force at the exact same time that illegal immigration started massively spiking. Jobs may be "gone" but there are sure a lot being filled by foreign nationals.
                            Correlation is not causation. And a lot of jobs are being filled by foreign nationals because they actually get better educations, have a better work ethic, and value math and science.




                            Purity of ideology is generally incorrect, regardless of what ideology one says they ascribe to. The real world is messy, nuanced, and has multiple, often conflicting, sometimes feedback based variables that are just as often related as not. Dealing with the real world requires patience, pragmatism, and sometimes bending over. No man is an island, and no scapegoated group is responsible for all societal ills. Parsing data oversimplifies real complexity and leads to false conclusions on everyone's part. The reality if illegal immigration is that there are pros and cons. The reality of immigration is that there are pros and cons. The reality of stopping immigration is that there are very little pros and very many cons, including stagnation due to lack of diversity that makes a population less resilient and less innovative and able to deal with the complexity of the real world.
                            Wonderful Life: The Burgess Shale and the Nature of HistoryPagan Devotionals, because the wind and the rain is our Bible
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                              Re: They are willing to destroy this country

                              I would also like to point out that - believe it or not - a refugee is not an asylum seeker and is not an illegal immigrant. There are very important distinctions between the three groups.
                              www.thewolfenhowlepress.com


                              Phantom Turnips never die.... they just get stewed occasionally....

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                                Re: They are willing to destroy this country

                                Generally a refugee is fleeing his or her country because it "Blew up" and a lot of times it is us who caused the blow up.

                                - - - Updated - - -

                                Also sometimes it is that pesky climate change that has put their country under water...
                                MAGIC is MAGIC,black OR white or even blood RED

                                all i ever wanted was a normal life and love.
                                NO TERF EVER WE belong Too.
                                don't stop the tears.let them flood your soul.




                                sigpic

                                my new page here,let me know what you think.


                                nothing but the shadow of what was

                                witchvox
                                http://www.witchvox.com/vu/vxposts.html

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