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Thread: what in hell causes the pain in life?

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    what in hell causes the pain in life?

    Have you ever think of these two ?
    Infatuated and Poisoned Love
    Want to Change or Control others

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    Kick Ass Little Crow Corvus's Avatar
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    Re: what in hell causes the pain in life?

    It's an old question. Why does suffering exist and why does god(s) allow it? Suffering is caused by desire. To want inevitably results in unfulfillment. We desire for love, for baubles, for food and water because we want to keep living, to be absent of pain and live in comfort, and countless other things. Without desire we would be happy because there would be no unfullfillment. If we do not need or desire, up to and including our desire to continue existing, then there can be no thing which causes us suffering. In a mindset where the ego is unmoored from the ills of the body even pain cannot harm us.

    Of course that would be to lose yourself. Humans are composed of their desires. What we want and like and value are integral to our expressions of self. Buddhism encourages ego erasure, to remove the self, as they have, correctly, determined the only state of existence which remains without suffering is that of nonexistence. As long as perception continues one risks falling into coveting and ambition which result in desire that brings about suffering.

    I'm of the opinion that to some degree suffering is necessary and an amount is somewhat good as it encourages compassion. Our first instincts are to avoid pain, and it is indeed good to prevent needless suffering in ourselves and others, however pain is an excellent teacher. To suffer in any capacity is to be united with the whole of wretched humanity who are all, at all times, experiences great and small levels of suffering as a result of existing as a person with a body.
    世の中に潜み落下した「アレ」はねえか? 誰が書き換える 世界の汚れは?
    Do you have 'that' which lies dormant within society? Who can overwrite it, the filth in the world?


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    Live and learn anunitu's Avatar
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    Re: what in hell causes the pain in life?

    hoping things are going well,little crow,best with the move.
    I must have a prodigious quantity of mind; it takes me as much as a week sometimes to make it up.
    Mark Twain

    Somewhat like Hunter S. Thompson who was called a gonzo Journalist,I consider myself to be something of a gonzo Pagan.

    The wizard be in: But be warned if you poke him to much,the standard wand of anal probing +10 may be utilized.

    It is interesting that humans seem to believe that they are the crown of creation,until nature drops a house on them....Just saying....

    I have decided that I no longer want to be an adult... If anyone needs me, I'll be in my blanket fort, coloring.

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    Member Eleanor's Avatar
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    Re: what in hell causes the pain in life?

    There can't be light without darkness. Without pain, we can't feel happiness. Pain makes our happiness feel like true happiness. The bad things in our life are not fun, but, as Corvus said, necessary. Without the bad, the good wouldn't feel as valuable and we would never develop ourselves.

    In the case of love, it's tricky. If your heart has been broken you're much likely to build a wall around it to protect yourself. It's the worst pain there is. But eventually, speaking from experience, those walls will come down again, without forgetting the lessons learned.

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    Apprentice of Doom Shahaku's Avatar
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    Re: what in hell causes the pain in life?

    Pain is essentially caused by attachment. When we lose the things we are attached to it hurts. There are evolutionary reasons for this. We create attachments because they help us to feel safe. This really gets distorted nowdays. But, when you lose something you're attached to you sort of have a fight or flight response because your reptilian brain is screaming "I'm in danger now!" That's basically how I understand it anyway.

    As to the spiritual, free will=the freedom to make bad decisions.
    Service to your fellows is the root of peace.

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    God in the baking SeanRave's Avatar
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    Re: what in hell causes the pain in life?

    Pain is the proof of love.

    Not that love is always positive nor healthy.
    I am a God in the making, report any glitches and bugs. We appreciate your feedback!
    If I thought gods were real, I would definitely let some of them touch me.
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    Re: what in hell causes the pain in life?

    Quote Originally Posted by Corvus View Post
    It's an old question. Why does suffering exist and why does god(s) allow it? Suffering is caused by desire. To want inevitably results in unfulfillment. We desire for love, for baubles, for food and water because we want to keep living, to be absent of pain and live in comfort, and countless other things. Without desire we would be happy because there would be no unfullfillment. If we do not need or desire, up to and including our desire to continue existing, then there can be no thing which causes us suffering. In a mindset where the ego is unmoored from the ills of the body even pain cannot harm us.

    Of course that would be to lose yourself. Humans are composed of their desires. What we want and like and value are integral to our expressions of self. Buddhism encourages ego erasure, to remove the self, as they have, correctly, determined the only state of existence which remains without suffering is that of nonexistence. As long as perception continues one risks falling into coveting and ambition which result in desire that brings about suffering.

    I'm of the opinion that to some degree suffering is necessary and an amount is somewhat good as it encourages compassion. Our first instincts are to avoid pain, and it is indeed good to prevent needless suffering in ourselves and others, however pain is an excellent teacher. To suffer in any capacity is to be united with the whole of wretched humanity who are all, at all times, experiences great and small levels of suffering as a result of existing as a person with a body.
    Seems it is not easy to erase desire. Or most of us are Buddhas now.
    Is desire for love right? Yes. Then how to get love?


    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by anunitu View Post
    hoping things are going well,little crow,best with the move.
    Yes, act more, quarrel less. Then we can forget about the annoying afairs.
    Chasing the Sun and Escaping the Night

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Eleanor View Post
    There can't be light without darkness. Without pain, we can't feel happiness. Pain makes our happiness feel like true happiness. The bad things in our life are not fun, but, as Corvus said, necessary. Without the bad, the good wouldn't feel as valuable and we would never develop ourselves.

    In the case of love, it's tricky. If your heart has been broken you're much likely to build a wall around it to protect yourself. It's the worst pain there is. But eventually, speaking from experience, those walls will come down again, without forgetting the lessons learned.
    If you still need pain, that means you haven't experienced enough pain. Then how much pain you want in your life? half and half enough?
    Why people are looking for happiness, and want to live happily, joyfully, freely? Who will wish others to be painful?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Shahaku View Post
    Pain is essentially caused by attachment. When we lose the things we are attached to it hurts. There are evolutionary reasons for this. We create attachments because they help us to feel safe. This really gets distorted nowdays. But, when you lose something you're attached to you sort of have a fight or flight response because your reptilian brain is screaming "I'm in danger now!" That's basically how I understand it anyway.

    As to the spiritual, free will=the freedom to make bad decisions.
    Yes, attachment is one of the causes.
    Whether it is money, rights and privileges, fame, positions, or people, as long as one attaches to things, one cannot have an independent consciousness and his own opinion, he will speak and act according to other people’s opinions or wills, and become a suffering slaver or puppet.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by SeanRave View Post
    Pain is the proof of love.

    Not that love is always positive nor healthy.
    Are you sure it is love? Is it not desire, posession, controlling, greed,selfishness,jealousy....?
    Is it ths same with Jesus' love? Do you agree with below description?

    Love is a state, like the constantly shining sun, the blooming peony, the roaring river, and the bright stars twinkling in the night sky with all their luster.
    Love has no specific target, it is wordless, but if there are specific targets, it is not love. The sun shines down constantly on everything, but if there is a target, it is not the sun, but a searchlight, a torch, or a spotlight. Love is like the shining sun and the blooming flowers. It is a state. Neither the sun nor the flowers ever say "I love you". No matter whether anyone is watching and no matter whether the bees and butterflies come to gather nectar, the flowers always bloom on time.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Love always brings warmth, auspiciousness, harmony, goodness, happiness, and positive energy, and is infinitely fascinating to all living beings. Love never shows coldness, madness, ugliness, worry, suffering, negative energy, or desperation.
    Love can not hurt anyone. If love leads to pain, grief, suffering, hatred, disappointment, or desperation, it can not be real love.

  8. #8
    God in the baking SeanRave's Avatar
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    Re: what in hell causes the pain in life?

    Nah, and I'm pretty sure desire, posession, the feeling of being in control, selfishness and some amount of jealousy are healthy.

    We are as much material beings as we are spiritual. Desire is natural, and it is one of the many drives and fuels to willpower. The individual can feel fulfilled through possessions and being in control as well. Greed without measure can be dangerous, but in moderate amounts it is a very good drive for willpower as well. Financial abundance is a common way of life fulfillment. Selfishness is vital for the survival of the individual. In fact, I dare say that selflessness is just a form of selfishness of which we are unaware of the true intentions. I do not believe in hard altruism. Jealousy, though can become toxic, in moderate amounts is a healthy way of reminding oneself and the object of jealousy of our current priorities. It allows us to introspect more about ourselves.

    Human emotions and behaviors are a beautiful thing. All of them, the good and the bad. And during a life, we owe our emotional complexity to feel each and every one of those emotions to the fullest.

    I don't care about Jesus' love, let alone believe he has anything to do with the divine. Hail Satan.

    Love is a state, like the constantly shining sun, the blooming peony, the roaring river, and the bright stars twinkling in the night sky with all their luster.
    Love has no specific target, it is wordless, but if there are specific targets, it is not love. The sun shines down constantly on everything, but if there is a target, it is not the sun, but a searchlight, a torch, or a spotlight. Love is like the shining sun and the blooming flowers. It is a state. Neither the sun nor the flowers ever say "I love you". No matter whether anyone is watching and no matter whether the bees and butterflies come to gather nectar, the flowers always bloom on time.
    No, I absolutely don't agree with this definition of love. All of those things you are citing are pretty metaphors, but to me, they represent nothing other than the trope of "all encompassing love" which is in my honest opinion a very overly-simplistic view of love.

    Love is a powerful emotion, but it is always an energy that is directed. Loving "everything" is akin to loving nothing.
    I am a God in the making, report any glitches and bugs. We appreciate your feedback!
    If I thought gods were real, I would definitely let some of them touch me.
    Check out my blog! The Daily Satanist

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    Live and learn anunitu's Avatar
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    Re: what in hell causes the pain in life?

    I agree sean,I found the idea presented as very based on naive ideas about life and the nature of humans .

    You sean seem to see clearly in the matter. Rock on!
    I must have a prodigious quantity of mind; it takes me as much as a week sometimes to make it up.
    Mark Twain

    Somewhat like Hunter S. Thompson who was called a gonzo Journalist,I consider myself to be something of a gonzo Pagan.

    The wizard be in: But be warned if you poke him to much,the standard wand of anal probing +10 may be utilized.

    It is interesting that humans seem to believe that they are the crown of creation,until nature drops a house on them....Just saying....

    I have decided that I no longer want to be an adult... If anyone needs me, I'll be in my blanket fort, coloring.

    Trust lost,is trust never regained.

    http://www.paganforum.com/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=186&dateline=1330020104

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    Re: what in hell causes the pain in life?

    Quote Originally Posted by SeanRave View Post
    Nah, and I'm pretty sure desire, posession, the feeling of being in control, selfishness and some amount of jealousy are healthy.

    We are as much material beings as we are spiritual. Desire is natural, and it is one of the many drives and fuels to willpower. The individual can feel fulfilled through possessions and being in control as well. Greed without measure can be dangerous, but in moderate amounts it is a very good drive for willpower as well. Financial abundance is a common way of life fulfillment. Selfishness is vital for the survival of the individual. In fact, I dare say that selflessness is just a form of selfishness of which we are unaware of the true intentions. I do not believe in hard altruism. Jealousy, though can become toxic, in moderate amounts is a healthy way of reminding oneself and the object of jealousy of our current priorities. It allows us to introspect more about ourselves.

    Human emotions and behaviors are a beautiful thing. All of them, the good and the bad. And during a life, we owe our emotional complexity to feel each and every one of those emotions to the fullest.

    I don't care about Jesus' love, let alone believe he has anything to do with the divine. Hail Satan.



    No, I absolutely don't agree with this definition of love. All of those things you are citing are pretty metaphors, but to me, they represent nothing other than the trope of "all encompassing love" which is in my honest opinion a very overly-simplistic view of love.

    Love is a powerful emotion, but it is always an energy that is directed. Loving "everything" is akin to loving nothing.
    Financial abundance is a common way of life fulfillment.
    -----what is the criterion of abundance? Millionaire or billionare? We now have much resources compared with before, but we still need more. Is this action of harming the Earth is from love?

    Greed without measure can be dangerous, but in moderate amounts it is a very good drive for willpower as well.
    -----why people want posess? because we feel unsafe. If we can treat each other as sisters and brothers, do we need to fight and posess?

    Is love hatred? why some loved couples get divorced later? How long will one's love last? If your love object changed, whose fault is it?
    If love leads to pain, is it real love?

    Love can only be felt by love. It cannot be demanded or taken by force, nor by money, status, fame, or beauty. Love is totally free, it is priceless, needs nothing in return, and is unconditional, with neither responsibilities, obligations, nor other requirements. Love treats everyone the same: beggars and billionaires, commoners and royalty. Love has no morals. Love has no system of values. Love lives in truth, kindness, beauty, and right, as well as in falseness, evil, ugliness, and wrong.
    Last edited by ivysunday; 25 Oct 2018 at 21:37.

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