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Thread: Save us from God...

  1. #11
    Live and learn anunitu's Avatar
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    Re: Save us from God...

    do not blame god,trump is a natural disaster! crap just floats to the top.
    Last edited by anunitu; 10 Feb 2019 at 16:07.
    MAGIC is MAGIC,black OR white or even blood RED

    all i ever wanted was a normal life and love.
    NO TERF EVER WE belong Too.
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  2. #12
    Moderator Azvanna's Avatar
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    Re: Save us from God...

    At this risk of derailing, I feel really really sorry for this lady. She has to go to work every day doing her best to make Trump look as good as she possibly can. I've watched her say some hideously stupid things. She knows her audience knows she's not making sense, but she has to stick to the script. I hope she's banking on the fact that we all know she has one of the most difficult jobs in the world. I think she's doing a tremendous job (see what I did there? ) going to work, separating what I'm sure her actual opinion would be from the function of her role.

    On topic: Romans 13:1 Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. (NIV)

    Make of that what you will.

    MO's reference expanded: Romans 9:17 17 For Scripture says to Pharaoh: “I raised you up for this very purpose, that I might display my power in you and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth.”

    I am so confused as to how God will be displaying his power through this President.
    Last edited by Azvanna; 10 Feb 2019 at 17:43.

  3. #13
    PF Ordo Hereticus MaskedOne's Avatar
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    Re: Save us from God...

    Quote Originally Posted by Azvanna View Post

    On topic: Romans 13:1 Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. (NIV)

    Make of that what you will.
    Pretty please, tell me that there is some context restricting that line. On its own and without qualifiers, its absurdedly easy to take it to very, very dark places. Also it would make the LoH directly responsible for some rather horrid people and while I'll grant that Romans 9:17

    For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might shew my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.
    Does imply that he raises up rulers that he intends to cast down, I find the idea that he's giving orders to people that they should follow a ruler that he explicitly intends to use as an object lesson to be a rather dishonorable ploy.

    Anyway, regarding Sanders, she's willfully holding onto a position that directly requires her to try and actively make one of the worst presidents in the last century look good. She has other options so I'm not feeling particularly sympathetic. There are Trump admin officials that I feel for (mostly Rosenstein these days though I could probably find others) but they tend to occupy positions that I find more vital than the one Sanders is in.
    "It is not simply enough to know the light…a Jedi must feel the tension between the two sides of the Force…in himself and in the universe."
    ―Thon

    "When to the Force you truly give yourself, all you do expresses the truth of who you are,"

    Yoda

    Yoda told stories, and ate, and cried, and laughed: and the Padawans saw that life itself was a lightsaber in his hands; even in the face of treachery and death and hopes gone cold, he burned like a candle in the darkness. Like a star shining in the black eternity of space.

    Yoda: Dark Rendezvous

    "But those men who know anything at all about the Light also know that there is a fierceness to its power, like the bare sword of the law, or the white burning of the sun." Suddenly his voice sounded to Will very strong, and very Welsh. "At the very heart, that is. Other things, like humanity, and mercy, and charity, that most good men hold more precious than all else, they do not come first for the Light. Oh, sometimes they are there; often, indeed. But in the very long run the concern of you people is with the absolute good, ahead of all else..."

    John Rowlands, The Grey King by Susan Cooper

    "You come from the Lord Adam and the Lady Eve", said Aslan. "And that is both honour enough to erect the head of the poorest beggar, and shame enough to bow the shoulders of the greatest emperor on earth; be content."

    Aslan, Prince Caspian by CS Lewis



  4. #14
    Moderator Azvanna's Avatar
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    Re: Save us from God...

    Quote Originally Posted by MaskedOne View Post
    Pretty please, tell me that there is some context restricting that line.
    It's pretty bad isn't it. What's more incredible is this was written around the time when Christians were experiencing religious persecution such as being used a human torch in Nero's garden.

    Here is the whole paragraph: 13 Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. 2 Consequently, whoever rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves. 3 For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong. Do you want to be free from fear of the one in authority? Then do what is right and you will be commended. 4 For the one in authority is God’s servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for rulers do not bear the sword for no reason. They are God’s servants, agents of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer. 5 Therefore, it is necessary to submit to the authorities, not only because of possible punishment but also as a matter of conscience.

    6 This is also why you pay taxes, for the authorities are God’s servants, who give their full time to governing. 7 Give to everyone what you owe them: If you owe taxes, pay taxes; if revenue, then revenue; if respect, then respect; if honor, then honor.

    When Paul writes letters, he usually includes reprimands of some sort but I'm not sure if any scholars have noted if this was a specific reprimand around a specific circumstance or if it was general teaching.

    Anyway, regarding Sanders, she's willfully holding onto a position that directly requires her to try and actively make one of the worst presidents in the last century look good. She has other options so I'm not feeling particularly sympathetic. There are Trump admin officials that I feel for (mostly Rosenstein these days though I could probably find others) but they tend to occupy positions that I find more vital than the one Sanders is in.
    I'm not very familiar with US politics... can she keep her role once this president is removed? Maybe she's hoping to stay put for the next president.

  5. #15
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    Re: Save us from God...

    Quote Originally Posted by Azvanna View Post
    It's pretty bad isn't it. What's more incredible is this was written around the time when Christians were experiencing religious persecution such as being used a human torch in Nero's garden.

    Here is the whole paragraph: 13 Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. 2 Consequently, whoever rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves. 3 For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong. Do you want to be free from fear of the one in authority? Then do what is right and you will be commended. 4 For the one in authority is God’s servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for rulers do not bear the sword for no reason. They are God’s servants, agents of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer. 5 Therefore, it is necessary to submit to the authorities, not only because of possible punishment but also as a matter of conscience.

    6 This is also why you pay taxes, for the authorities are God’s servants, who give their full time to governing. 7 Give to everyone what you owe them: If you owe taxes, pay taxes; if revenue, then revenue; if respect, then respect; if honor, then honor.

    When Paul writes letters, he usually includes reprimands of some sort but I'm not sure if any scholars have noted if this was a specific reprimand around a specific circumstance or if it was general teaching.



    I'm not very familiar with US politics... can she keep her role once this president is removed? Maybe she's hoping to stay put for the next president.
    Yeah, that just gets more depressing as it goes on.

    Anyway, the position Sanders is in is not a career post and doesn't normally transfer over to a new administration. It can but doing so is entirely at the whim of the new President.
    "It is not simply enough to know the light…a Jedi must feel the tension between the two sides of the Force…in himself and in the universe."
    ―Thon

    "When to the Force you truly give yourself, all you do expresses the truth of who you are,"

    Yoda

    Yoda told stories, and ate, and cried, and laughed: and the Padawans saw that life itself was a lightsaber in his hands; even in the face of treachery and death and hopes gone cold, he burned like a candle in the darkness. Like a star shining in the black eternity of space.

    Yoda: Dark Rendezvous

    "But those men who know anything at all about the Light also know that there is a fierceness to its power, like the bare sword of the law, or the white burning of the sun." Suddenly his voice sounded to Will very strong, and very Welsh. "At the very heart, that is. Other things, like humanity, and mercy, and charity, that most good men hold more precious than all else, they do not come first for the Light. Oh, sometimes they are there; often, indeed. But in the very long run the concern of you people is with the absolute good, ahead of all else..."

    John Rowlands, The Grey King by Susan Cooper

    "You come from the Lord Adam and the Lady Eve", said Aslan. "And that is both honour enough to erect the head of the poorest beggar, and shame enough to bow the shoulders of the greatest emperor on earth; be content."

    Aslan, Prince Caspian by CS Lewis



  6. #16
    Moderator Azvanna's Avatar
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    Re: Save us from God...

    Quote Originally Posted by MaskedOne View Post
    Yeah, that just gets more depressing as it goes on.
    Add to the conundrum the fact that Paul himself was imprisoned almost constantly for preaching the Gospel and was eventually matyred for it. There's also the story of Paul and Silas's miraculous prison break (Acts 16). There's a precedent in Acts 5 Where Peter is challenged for preaching the gospel and he replies with 'in this, we must obey God, not man' or something to that affect. Take away lesson: obey the law unless it is incongruent with the Gospel, especially evangelistic efforts.


    Anyway, the position Sanders is in is not a career post and doesn't normally transfer over to a new administration. It can but doing so is entirely at the whim of the new President.
    *shakes head* I'm all out of defense for her.

  7. #17
    The Gaze of the Abyss B. de Corbin's Avatar
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    Re: Save us from God...

    Yeah...

    Sanders knew the job, took the job, does the job, and is therefore complicit in what the job requires her to do. No excuses for her.
    Those who have suffered understand suffering and therefore extend their hand.

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  8. #18
    Live and learn anunitu's Avatar
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    Re: Save us from God...

    that syuff might work for trump,if he were in fact "a man of God" he seems motivated by a much darker power in my take on his actions sarah must take on her blame in connection to trumps negative effect on civil rights and compassion for the down trodden caging children,can not be excused or even forgiven i think. that is my opinion at any rate
    MAGIC is MAGIC,black OR white or even blood RED

    all i ever wanted was a normal life and love.
    NO TERF EVER WE belong Too.
    don't stop the tears.let them flood your soul.




    http://www.paganforum.com/image.php?type=sigpic&userid=186&dateline=1330020104

    my new page here,let me know what you think.


    nothing but the shadow of what was

  9. #19
    Bronze Member Bartmanhomer's Avatar
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    Re: Save us from God...

    I have no sympathy and respect for Sanders. That just my honest opinion.

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