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    #31
    Re: Mixing Catholicism with Witchcraft?

    Originally posted by turningtides View Post
    It's a good question that I think about, since I DO mix Catholicism and Witchcraft--or rather, just the Craft and/or pagan awareness, as I am not Wiccan. When you say mixing both Catholicism and Witchcraft, are you talking about Wicca/the Craft itself as the religion? Or do you mean the Craft as a system of worship to God(s)? In my mind, the Craft is also the elements that many of our ancestors did in the past to worship the gods. How 'pagan' it is might depend on which side of the fence a person is standing in.

    In Catholicism there is both Scripture and Tradition. And within the Tradition there is "popular piety", which is basically the celebrations and worship of the people as they have done, often long before Christianity walked onto that country's shores. While the people DO worship the divine in Christianity (the Holy Trinity, Mary, and the saints), Your Mileage May Vary quickly comes into play. The veneration of Mary herself was a groundswell from the people until the Church could no longer ignore it or Her. I do leave offerings of flowers, stones and seasonal items at my shrine to Mary, and make prayer beads as I petition the guide(s)/angels of the receiver to bless it. I have an angel oracle deck that I use to probe my own understanding, but it's still divination. The bible itself has several examples of magic and divination by the prophets. Most Catholics would NOT worship the Triple Goddess, the Green Man, or any deities from other pantheons. That doesn't mean that there haven't been elements of paganism and magic within Christianity itself, that is already practiced by other Christians (speaking in tongues, laying on of hands, etc.).
    Sorry, I wasn't the OP of this thread, and was only responding to the OP, so I can not answer your questions to the best of my abilities. She was talking about Witchcraft, so I was assuming she did not mean Wicca.

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      #32
      Re: Mixing Catholicism with Witchcraft?

      There are so many blatant contradictions in the Bible, or things that the Bible says to do or not do that don't fit with our society anymore so we just ignore them, that from a logical standpoint, I don't see how it would be any different to simply ignore the parts of the Bible that say "no witchcraft." BUT, Catholicism isn't just about Bible passages - it's very much a sect of Christianity that has a lot of "unwritten" rules, and even if you can tell yourself that witchcraft fits just fine with it, I doubt many fellow Catholics or priests would agree with you.

      Not saying that you can't just make up your own rules and live your religion the way you want, just that you're gonna need to be ok with not being a "true" Catholic in a lot of people's eyes. I agree with previous statements that it would probably just be better to be a pagan who believes in Christ rather than trying to force yourself into a very specific Christian sect that wouldn't be accepting of other practices that you want in your spiritual life.

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        #33
        Re: Mixing Catholicism with Witchcraft?

        Oh, that's ok! I think about toward the end of it I was mixing the two. Whoops!

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          #34
          Re: Mixing Catholicism with Witchcraft?

          Even if someone isn't supposed to do something, it doesn't mean it doesn't happen anyway. What about traditions like Voudon that have a very catholic front--Saint's pictures tied to each being, praying to God first, etc, etc? Cannon and culture are often two entirely different things.
          Great Grandmother's Kitchen

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            #35
            Re: Mixing Catholicism with Witchcraft?

            Originally posted by WillowMoon View Post
            I hope it's ok to jump in t this thread since it's a little old. Please kindly let me know if it is not, because on another forum that I do not go to any more, I got ridiculed for it, and it was not listed anywhere in the rules.
            If its open, feel free to go for it... If its old and not archived and we *don't* want someone answering it, then us mods/admins got sloppy/lazy at archiving and it is our fault, not yours. The only caveat to that, is if it is a specific personal issue that someone has posted about---unless you have/have had the same issue or something and want to share, if you notice that it is an old thread, it might not be applicable anymore, and you might not want to bother. There is very little we generally ridicule anyone for on this forum...really just rudeness and claiming UPG as some sort of universalism.

            Anyway, I was going to open up a different thread, before I found this post, because I am wondering almost the same, about Christianity and Paganism being combined. (that was a disaster discussion on a the same web site as I mentioned above) I don't know if it can easily be meshed together without someone stepping in and questioning you. I think, that if you have the ability to back up your reasoning, then yes, you could possibly mix both Catholicism and Witchcraft.
            IMO: Someone will always disagree/disapprove of your beliefs and practices and question them--whether it be eating meat, bottle feeding your child, believing in evolution...or religion. If someone has such little confidence in their beliefs that being questioned (or even criticized--which is different from being harassed) is personally demoralizing, then they should either rethink their beliefs or keep them to their selves.

            With that being said...in response to the issue raised by the title--in all technicality, witchcraft (as I said in the beginning of this thread) is a *practice* (and one that encompasses a fairly large number of individual practices), not a belief system (though witchcraft can be combined with a belief system--as with some forms of Wicca) in and of itself. How an individual chooses to reconcile their practice of witchcraft with their religious practices that may prohibit it (such as Catholicism) is their business (isn't that what confession is good for? ). I might add that witchcraft (or practices within witchcraft) is not necessarily prohibited for all Christianities (particularly liberal denominations such as the United Church of Christ or Christian-identifying Unitarian Universalists, etc)...not everyone (including Catholics) reads the Bible literally (or agrees with all the tenants of their faith--like my Catholic mother who is pro-choice, used birth control, disbelieves in the infallibility of the pope, thinks homosexual relationships should be approved by the church and thinks women should be priests...maybe she should have stayed UCC where all that is okay, lol).

            Taking that to a wider discussion of mixing Paganism with Christianity, I have met (in my almost 20 years of being Pagan) quite a few people (online and off) that combine Jesus with their Paganism or aspects of Pagan religions with their Jesus (from Christo-Pagan syncretists to Trinitarian Wiccans to non-denominational Christian kitchen witches). Whether one considers them both Christian and Pagan depends on one's definition of Pagan and Christian. Syncretic and parallel practices and beliefs appear to have existed in whatever cultures Christianity expanded into, so I'm not too sure why people today are so freaked out about it now, and act like Christianity is some monolithic faith (yes, it is monotheistic--mostly, depending on your perspective...but their are still some 38,000 denominations of it that can't even agree on what a Christian *is*) that can't be combined with other beliefs or practices (IMO, this changes when you specify a particular denomination--some of them have stringent requirements).
            Wonderful Life: The Burgess Shale and the Nature of HistoryPagan Devotionals, because the wind and the rain is our Bible
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              #36
              Re: Mixing Catholicism with Witchcraft?

              Not to throw the thread for a loop but I think witchcraft and Christianity would work fine if the witch was going by pre-council of Nicea (I'm probably spelling that wrong, sorry) doctrine or even strictly Christ-based principles, which for many Christians is what the faith is really about. The gospel is to love EVERYONE and God. A witch can do that just as much as a non-witch can.
              When you consider that the bible is written by man and inspired by God...after much debate, re-writing, voting on topics such as reincarnation and what not to do...then there is room for interpretation.
              I see no reason why a witch can't call upon God in aid of a healing spell for a friend - isn't herbalism plus faith a sort of magic anyways? Or pray to Christ for aid in prosperity while lighting a green candle. Many witches are monotheist anyways.
              I feel like trying to say someone can't be a Christian and a Witch is really splitting hairs in this day and age.

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                #37
                Re: Mixing Catholicism with Witchcraft?

                Originally posted by DCorobane View Post
                Isn't herbalism plus faith a sort of magic anyways?
                Faith may be a type of magic, or magic may be a type of faith, but leave the herbs out of it. Many herbs, plants & various other organic substances contain compounds that have valid medicinal properties (i.e., drugs) and are the organic basis for many synthesized pharmaceuticals.
                The forum member formerly known as perzephone. Or Perze. I've shed a skin.

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                  #38
                  Re: Mixing Catholicism with Witchcraft?

                  Originally posted by greenwood01 View Post
                  Sounds pretty oxymoronic .....
                  On the face of it, yes.

                  But actually, Catholicism contains many pagan elements.

                  So the two may go well together, if well understood.

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                    #39
                    Re: Mixing Catholicism with Witchcraft?

                    As I talked about recently in another thread, there's considerable precedence of Christianity mixing with "pagan" folk magic practices/beliefs in the form of Folk Christianity. It was really the norm rather than the exception up until the Early Modern period, though strains of it still persisted through cultural customs, folk beliefs, and folklore--just think of the devotions and patronage ascribed to certain Saints. And sometimes in the form of cunning-folk, healers, and mystics. Even family traditions thereof. It's arguably seen a sort-of revival since the 1960's, at least in the US, considering how popular certain Spiritualist and semi-New Age thought is.

                    And a side note: "Witchcraft" as talked about in the pagan revival is a very retroactive term. It wouldn't have ever been what people called themselves; rather it'd be seen as the socially-unacceptable or fringe elements of folk magic practices. When modern pagans say "witchcraft" they mean something along the lines of "folk magic" as set of traditional practices.
                    Last edited by Louisvillian; 14 Jun 2012, 11:39.

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                      #40
                      Re: Mixing Catholicism with Witchcraft?

                      Originally posted by greenwood01 View Post
                      Sounds pretty oxymoronic but, i've heard of people practicing both. Any input anyone?
                      You can mix almost anything. Televangelists mix Christianity, which exalts the poor, with get rich quick and prosperity messages, not to mention the defrauding of their viewers. The Catholic church's practices are counter to Biblical mandate in so many ways that it would take more space to enumerate them than would be tasteful in one post, but having a priesthood is technically non-biblical, as is addressing a priest (or anyone else but God for that matter) as father (though I do not know of any Christian of any denomination who keeps to this; they all seem to call their Earthly father their father). So too is the fashioning of graven images (that was never undone in the NT), but a Catholic church is filled with them.

                      I have a very lengthy Catholic background, so I do feel somewhat qualified to answer. The many comments to the effect of 'you can, but don't tell your priest' is pretty accurate. As others have mentioned, there are a good many Catholics who engage in practices that are not approved by the Church. Then you have actions on the part of the clergy that violate Cannon law, Biblical command, and civil law, and yet those priests are not only not excommunicated, but are actively shielded from civil authorities.

                      I've only recently stopped identifying myself as Catholic, mainly because the amount of differences between the Catholic Church and my own beliefs have accumulated to such a degree that I felt it was no longer appropriate. The 2004 scandals and handling thereof kind of pushed me over the edge as well.

                      If someone wants to do it, I personally wouldn't call them 'not Catholic,' as that is really between them and their confessor, and I certainly would not frown upon them doing so. But given the Catholic position on witchcraft, I'm not sure why anyone would want to.
                      Last edited by Celtic Tiger; 14 Jun 2012, 18:30.

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                        #41
                        Re: Mixing Catholicism with Witchcraft?

                        I actually tried studying witchcraft back when I was Catholic, and I guess I'm still into it but in no way as much as I was before. There's no problem mixing beliefs or religions really, in my opinion. It just all adds up to your deeds on earth and if you served God well. Also as long as you don't use witchcraft for immoral purposes. I'm not saying that it's right, but at the same time I'm not saying it's wrong either. However an individual can become closer to God or their gods spiritually can help them find a place where they feel they belong and... :S
                        um basically I don't find anything wrong in combining beliefs/religions (as said before).
                        "Rivers, ponds, lakes and streams - they all have different names, but they all contain water. Just as religions do - they all contain truths."
                        -Muhammad Ali

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                          #42
                          Re: Mixing Catholicism with Witchcraft?

                          Neither do I. What I consider real witchcraft (as in non codified neopaganism the folk stuff that inspired neopaganism) is practiced all over the world by catholics. Its only the people who decide that witchcraft is a religion who have a problem with it.

                          Id take 2 issues with them.
                          1. Most of them are protestants and have no idea what real ritual is like in religion anyway because they rely on a personal relationship with god and listen to an untrained pastor IF they go to services at all.
                          2.IME they are the minority of 'witches'. There are far more people out there practicing then even know the word witchcraft.Marketing a term doesnt make you the owner of it.

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                            #43
                            Re: Mixing Catholicism with Witchcraft?

                            Originally posted by JamesByrne View Post
                            Marketing a term doesnt make you the owner of it.
                            Oh yes. Absolutely!
                            www.thewolfenhowlepress.com


                            Phantom Turnips never die.... they just get stewed occasionally....

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                              #44
                              Re: Mixing Catholicism with Witchcraft?

                              My whole life I have been a Catholic and still do consider myself a Catholic. My inspiration into Paganism began with research St Francis of Assisi who was truly one with Nature. Remember while most people would tell you Wicca is inherintley evil it really is not at all, especially if it brings you closer to "God".

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                                #45
                                Re: Mixing Catholicism with Witchcraft?

                                Catholicism has been providing a cover for African Diaspora religions, Stregheria, etc., etc., for years. It lends itself well to that kind of thing.

                                It probably doesn't make you a "proper" Catholic, but it'll keep people from freaking out when they come to your house.

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