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Finding a Patron Deity (what did I do wrong and what can I do to make amends?)

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    Finding a Patron Deity (what did I do wrong and what can I do to make amends?)

    So, I'm sure everyone here remembers being a wee little pagan lass or lad, so excited about their new spirituality and more than eager to research and read everything they find.
    Well, unfortunately, the last three years have definitely had a lot of research- just not a lot of excitement towards paganism.

    Basically, I met this girl on an online horse game when I was really young (and about to get confirmed into the catholic church) and -this sounds bad- she was the first 'pagan' I really ever met. She told me all about her Greek reconstructionalist ways and I was fascinated. I did loads of research on this whole spiritual belief system that I had no idea existed and found after a few weeks that I wanted in.
    That was three years ago and I'm still not so sure what I believe.
    ANYHOW, recently I've gotten back into the neo-pagan thing (I consider myself a hedgewitch, really) and decided it was time to do some soul-searching and meditation as to find my patron diety. Articles upon articles later, I discovered that Apollo and I had loads in common and that I was certain he was my patron deity. (up until then I used Athena as sort of a back-up, go to goddess, which is terrible, I know.)
    So i thought really hard on the idea and finally set up a baby ritual to ask Apollo to be my patron and to thank him, etc.
    Well, there's isn't too much info online about finding a patron deity, so basically I figured it's up to the person to figure it out themselves.
    I must have done something wrong.
    The next morning after my dedication ceremony to Apollo, I woke up with a sinus infection. (a bit of a coincidence, don't you think, as Apollo is the god of healing?)
    Obviously, I took this as a bad sign but figured it could be his way of testing me, etc. today, I did a ritual to ask for healing from my awful illness (along with prayer and offerings) and when I was done and thanked Apollo, I picked up my little votive candle- only to spill hot wax all over my hand and altar.
    So, obviously something is wrong. Is he not actually my patron deity and is trying to inform me if this? It's a bit heartbreaking, really, because he and I have so much and common and upon researching him extensively I felt 'at home.'

    Any advice would be greatly appreciated, as I'm a total god-newb and sort of just really beginning paganism.
    Thanks for your time and blessed be!
    -Spitfire

    #2
    Re: Finding a Patron Deity (what did I do wrong and what can I do to make amends?)

    Originally posted by spitfire: View Post
    Any advice would be greatly appreciated, as I'm a total god-newb and sort of just really beginning paganism.
    Thanks for your time and blessed be!
    -Spitfire
    I think you might be going a little too fast with this 'patron' thing. Just because you and a deity have loads in common doesn't mean that that deity is going to like you. I know someone who is a pacifist vegan who thinks "the ends justify the means" is a horrible ethos to adopt, and guess which deity grabbed him? Odin. I know it's a hard thing to accept, but sometimes a deity says "no, sorry, you're not mine" no matter how much you think you would be a good match for them. Be patient! Sometimes the right deity comes along, and it's absolutely okay to not have a patron deity at all! (Some people get so wrapped up in 'the Great Patron Hunt' that they forget that many Pagans don't have patrons.)

    Again, it kind of sounds to me like you were being hasty, especially by setting up a ritual (and a dedication ritual, at that) to Apollo without (it sounds like) introducing yourself to him first. It's a bit like showing up to a random stranger's house and asking if you can throw a party on their front lawn, or like walking up to some random stranger and saying: "You're my friend now! Let's go on a road trip!" To put this in perspective, I've felt a particular closeness to Freyja for a couple years now, and I'm not even CONSIDERING the possibility of oathing to her until I'm good and ready for it.

    So, without knowing all the details, I think it's quite possible that he may be, well, a little ticked off, telling you that he's not your patron, or both. Either way, I think it would be best to make an offering and apologize.

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      #3
      Re: Finding a Patron Deity (what did I do wrong and what can I do to make amends?)

      Hi there

      Let me start off by saying, you dont choose the gods, the Gods choose you. I thought I had to have a patron deity right away, but that isnt the case. Maybe apollo is, or maybe apollo isnt your patron deity. Right now that isnt the case. The divine run on there own time, and come to you when they are ready. I was very disapointed when I thought I would never have in contact with a deity. However I stopped worrying about. After I stopped expecting to see contact from a deity, one came to me. She showed me symbology that got me every day. Same with spirit guides, they do this when you least expect it. My advice to you is, for now just go with the flow. Also say a little prayer something like "any god or goddess who wants to have some relation with me, I will be waiting" And soon you will know that , that is the god or goddess for you. Here are some ways I know the gods (or a spirit guide not the case though) is wanting my attention. Observe your daily surroundings. The divine communicates throughout some of your senses. If you hear a sound, that keeps coming up over and over again jot it down. Also thoughts count as hearing too. If You have a feeling that something is different and a deities pressence jot that down. Sight is the biggest communcication they can contact you in. If you see a certain type of animal, or symbol, or anything over and over and over again, and it is being soo repetitive, then jot that down. Once you are done, check your notes, and then go online. Ill give you an example for me. I kept seeing cats everywhere I went. After I prayed id see cats, I use to get bit by cats, driving everyday I would see a cat, asking for protection Id see cats, and so I looked up cat goddesses. I saw The Goddess Bast. She is also a goddess of protection and many other forms too. Thats how I knew she was wanting to contact me, through repetition of symbols and animals. It takes time, but soon if your paitent enough, and least expect it, and observe your surroundings, spirit will tell you and come to you. They run on there own time, and show us things in symbolic imgery. Also keep dreams in mind as well. Hope this has helped, good luck on your path, and hope the right deity comes to you (or Apollo comes around) just observe your surroundings, and journal things, look for signs and symbols and your good Good luck blessed be

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        #4
        Re: Finding a Patron Deity (what did I do wrong and what can I do to make amends?)

        The advice above is very good. You might also want to consider other solar deities, if Apollo appeals but doesn't feel right.

        Another thing to think about, is that after particular initiations, the recipient will sometimes (frequently in my experience), become unwell and/or spaced out for a few days afterwards, while they adjust to a new state of being and clear out blockages. I have heard this is common with reiki attunement (Caelia? Is this true?), so as a god of healing, could this not actually be a normal part of a dedication to him?

        Having said that, it seems that your gut instinct is telling you this is a sign Apollo isn't your patron. Gut instincts are usually right, so I agree with Wind and Lokabrenna: don't rush, keep studying and your patron, should you require one, will appear in their own time.
        Last edited by Jembru; 19 Apr 2012, 14:50.
        夕方に急なにわか雨は「夕立」と呼ばれるなら、なぜ朝ににわか雨は「朝立ち」と呼ばれないの? ^^If a sudden rain shower in the evening is referred to as an 'evening stand', then why isn't a shower in the morning called 'morning stand'?

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          #5
          Re: Finding a Patron Deity (what did I do wrong and what can I do to make amends?)

          Well...you can dedicate yourself to a particular deity without them being your patron anyhow... Really, IMO, "dedication" is more like an application with intent...the "patronage" is the relationship that develops later (or not). I work (quite closely and devotedly) with several deities without any of them being my "patron"...because (quite honestly) I don't want one.

          I wouldn't necessarily take a sinus infection and a spill as a cosmic no--a sinus infection brews for days before you get symptoms and accidents happen. But, maybe you are rushing things, and subconsciously you know it, and hence, doubt.

          You don't have to rush into a relationship with anyone--god or not...and for every person that says some variation of "the god chooses you", I've probably known as many people who chose the god they wanted to talk to and scored on them talking back (and in some cases it took time and dedication to "prove" themselves)--deities can be just as vain as people, and would rather talk to people that want to talk to them, and often want you to work for it (even if you aren't in a patron relationship).
          Wonderful Life: The Burgess Shale and the Nature of HistoryPagan Devotionals, because the wind and the rain is our Bible
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            #6
            Re: Finding a Patron Deity (what did I do wrong and what can I do to make amends?)

            Originally posted by Jembru View Post
            The advice above is very good. You might also want to consider other solar deities, if Apollo appeals but doesn't feel right.

            Another thing to think about, is that after particular initiations, the recipient will sometimes (frequently in my experience), become unwell and/or spaced out for a few days afterwards, while they adjust to a new state of being and clear out blockages. I have heard this is common with reiki attunement (Caelia? Is this true?), so as a god of healing, could this not actually be a normal part of a dedication to him?

            Having said that, it seems that your gut instinct is telling you this is a sign Apollo isn't your patron. Gut instincts are usually right, so I agree with Wind and Lokabrenna: don't rush, keep studying and your patron, should you require one, will appear in their own time.

            I also second the advice you've been given. Some great stuff.

            As for Reiki you go through stuff like this if you need to "purge" especially with drug and alcohol abuse. The worst I had was the munchies, but I was also bulimic at the time.
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            "...leave me curled up in my ball,
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            ill prepared, but willing,
            to descend."

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              #7
              Re: Finding a Patron Deity (what did I do wrong and what can I do to make amends?)

              I forgot to mention, you may even come to the point you dont even need to label the divine, ya know? Like maybe you might worship just one great goddess, or great god, that some call "Mother earth, or great mother" and "father sky, or great father" It all depends on how you view deity as well right? You might be monothestic and polytheistic, just like the hindus, they believe in one all great power called brahman, which have different forms , which are there gods. (they also believe in some form of "holy trinity" Brahma, vishnu and shiva) However you might view deity as numerous amounts of gods, and not just one god with forms. Within time your view of deity changes and shapes, just like your spirituality. Also ya , other peoples advice on here is really great to listen too. The ones who have commented on this post so far, have really great knowledge and know what there talking about. And I agree with you thalassa, sometimes you can choose a god and it may click with you. I just say sometimes the gods choose you, because for personal experience (this varies for all people) sometimes its easy for me to let me message me instead of expecting. Anywho, good luck again, and hope all works out (trust me it will all go together soon,)

              Comment


                #8
                Re: Finding a Patron Deity (what did I do wrong and what can I do to make amends?)

                Oops. I typed this up hours ago and it's been sitting here on my laptop because I forgot to actually post it...

                I don't know if I'd go so far as to say Apollo is rejecting you, spitfire. Especially because you consider yourself new to Paganism, I wouldn't assume anything right away. If you don't have the personal experience to say, for instance, "Hey, this kind of thing has happened before, so maybe that's what's going on this time," then it makes it harder to read the signs. Since it's Apollo we're talking about, I would actually be more likely to believe he would be harder on his devotees because he expects a lot from them, just because that's the kind of personality I feel from Apollo. I imagine he would be difficult to please, somehow... I've never approached him, though, so I wouldn't know.

                But I agree that it sounds like a little soon for establishing patronage. You might want to spend some time with him, offer worship and show your dedication through acts of devotion, like reciting hymns and offering sacrifices. Maybe you could pick up a string instrument (where would one find a lyre these days I wonder?) or learn a few styles of divination since Apollo is an oracular deity.

                (There was more to this post but others have basically said the same.) Good luck

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                  #9
                  Re: Finding a Patron Deity (what did I do wrong and what can I do to make amends?)

                  your patrons will reveal themselves to you when the time is right... i had a spirit guide i knew of since I was in 1st grade... found out about a year ago it was a patron deity in disguise. Also my other patron had come to me in a dream and i didnt even realize it until years later who it was.. so it all comes in time. until then, take in what lessons life has to offer, and learn from what surrounds you, and all will be revealed in time.
                  "Sometimes bad things happen, and theres nothing you can do about it, so why worry?" ~ Timon

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                    #10
                    Re: Finding a Patron Deity (what did I do wrong and what can I do to make amends?)

                    I also second, third and fourth the great advice given here. And I feel for you, it's very awkward to receive a 'Return to Sender' message after asking after a deity. There are deities I would love to have as my patron because they are the embodiedment of a qualit I wish I had, or they are the patron deity of my job. That didn't automatically translate to Them and I becoming buddies or even passing acquaintances'.

                    In your questing and thinking, be sincere and be open to the responses you get. Ask Apollo himself if he is interested in becoming your patron, and how he would manifest these answers to you in a way you can recognize. Ask yourself, which images/symbols of Apollo resonate most deeply with you. (I'm not clear on all his symbols and associations, just aware that he has several.) It won't hurt to take more time.

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                      #11
                      Re: Finding a Patron Deity (what did I do wrong and what can I do to make amends?)

                      Originally posted by thalassa View Post
                      Well...you can dedicate yourself to a particular deity without them being your patron anyhow... Really, IMO, "dedication" is more like an application with intent...the "patronage" is the relationship that develops later (or not). I work (quite closely and devotedly) with several deities without any of them being my "patron"...because (quite honestly) I don't want one.

                      I wouldn't necessarily take a sinus infection and a spill as a cosmic no--a sinus infection brews for days before you get symptoms and accidents happen. But, maybe you are rushing things, and subconsciously you know it, and hence, doubt.

                      You don't have to rush into a relationship with anyone--god or not...and for every person that says some variation of "the god chooses you", I've probably known as many people who chose the god they wanted to talk to and scored on them talking back (and in some cases it took time and dedication to "prove" themselves)--deities can be just as vain as people, and would rather talk to people that want to talk to them, and often want you to work for it (even if you aren't in a patron relationship).
                      ^^^ This so much.

                      You don't have to rush anything. The Divine, in whatever form you believe it exists, has been around a looooong time. You've got your whole life. Take your time.

                      Patronage can go two ways. Yes, a deity can 'choose' you to serve Them, and this can be both wonderful and terrifying. Being noticed by a God or spiritual entity isn't always safe or easy. Sometimes it's a deity you don't even like or care to associate yourself with, in which case you can end up feeling like your whole life has become the butt of a cosmic joke. Having spent many a year with Coyote (a notorious trickster) as a spirit mis-Guide is not as fun as it sounds. Apollo is a bit of a tricksy God Himself, and He's not always kind to His followers.

                      You can also dedicate yourself to a deity, and serve Them, and eventually a relationship can develop. Sometimes it won't. It's kind of like getting a job - sometimes, the job fits you and you fit the job, and you find a career. Sometimes, the job doesn't work out and you go look in a different direction.

                      Patrons can also change as you change. I've served Persephone and Hades consciously for almost 30 years, but as I've grown I realized They were too severe, too harsh and too distant. I still honor Them, but I'm rebuilding an earlier relationship I had with Luna. She's always been there, too, but I went in a different direction originally. It took a lot of soul-searching and a year or two of waffling to determine that it was ok for me to 'switch' patrons.

                      However it works out for you, it's always worth the ride. Good luck
                      The forum member formerly known as perzephone. Or Perze. I've shed a skin.

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                        #12
                        Re: Finding a Patron Deity (what did I do wrong and what can I do to make amends?)

                        I'm thinking that a God/Goddess/both is/are trying to contact me, but I haven't been very successful at finding answers, and I was hoping somebody here could possibly help me? I have been seeing Coyote's, about everyday. And if I don't see them, I hear, or am reminded of them. And for a long time I've been hearing a incoherent yelling noise. I've never thought that it could be a God trying to contact me. And I also get insane amounts of Deja Vu. Like, for almost everything I do. Thanks in advance. )O(

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                          #13
                          Re: Finding a Patron Deity (what did I do wrong and what can I do to make amends?)

                          Originally posted by thalassa View Post
                          Well...you can dedicate yourself to a particular deity without them being your patron anyhow... Really, IMO, "dedication" is more like an application with intent...the "patronage" is the relationship that develops later (or not). I work (quite closely and devotedly) with several deities without any of them being my "patron"...because (quite honestly) I don't want one.

                          I wouldn't necessarily take a sinus infection and a spill as a cosmic no--a sinus infection brews for days before you get symptoms and accidents happen. But, maybe you are rushing things, and subconsciously you know it, and hence, doubt.

                          You don't have to rush into a relationship with anyone--god or not...and for every person that says some variation of "the god chooses you", I've probably known as many people who chose the god they wanted to talk to and scored on them talking back (and in some cases it took time and dedication to "prove" themselves)--deities can be just as vain as people, and would rather talk to people that want to talk to them, and often want you to work for it (even if you aren't in a patron relationship).
                          Lots of good advice and information from the folks on the forum as always.
                          I think thalassa may have summed it up the best(in my humble opinion no offense to anyone else). I am one of those in the pagan community that does not have a deity, though some times I will ask for assistance from one. I have considered myself a pagan for decades and have never felt myself drawn to any one particular deity. Like it's been said some have one, some don't.
                          Take your time, read a lot(remember everything you read may not pertain to you) , but most of all go with what feels right for you.

                          Side note to thalassa: your remain calm and squirrel made me laugh and think of my youngest daughter away at collage and her sorority(Alpha, Lambda, Delta, I think) is known as the squirrels. It so fits her persona
                          Gargoyles watch over me...I can hear them snicker in the dark.


                          Pull the operating handle (which protrudes from the right side of the receiver) smartly to the rear and release it.

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