Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Dionysos Worship Q&A

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    Dionysos Worship Q&A

    I've worshiped Dionysos for several years now; the beginning was blurry and not well-defined, and so I'll never really be sure when our relationship began. Feel free to ask any questions concerning Dionysos and his worship! The previous incarnation of this thread was a great help to me in terms of testing my knowledge and helping me get some perspective on things I've experienced, and I think others have gained some knowledge as well!

    #2
    Re: Questions About Dionysos Worship

    Can you give me a little general information? I know so little about what you do that I can't formulate a reasonable question - but I'm curious.

    I must have overlooked the before thread... Now that we've got all this elbow room, I can start at the beginning ;D
    Every moment of a life is a horrible tragedy, a slapstick comedy, dark nihilism, golden illumination, or nothing at all; depending on how we write the story we tell ourselves.

    Comment


      #3
      Re: Questions About Dionysos Worship

      [quote author=B. de Corbin link=topic=70.msg788#msg788 date=1286725006]
      Can you give me a little general information? I know so little about what you do that I can't formulate a reasonable question - but I'm curious. I must have overlooked the before thread... Now that we've got all this elbow room, I can start at the beginning ;D
      [/quote]

      Absolutely! I probably should have elaborated in my original post about what I believe, anyhow... I'll try to give a short, broad summary of why I worship him and how.

      Dionysos is my patron deity; the god that I worship above all others, who I call on for help regardless of the situation, who I celebrate most frequently. Dionysos represents madness and drunkenness as well as theatre, androgyny, fertility, indulgence, freedom and mystery, among a ton of other things. I can feel a personal connection to him through a lot of those things as part of my personality, beliefs, values, experiences, etc. For instance, Dionysos helps me understand and deal with my own tendency to indulge, he helps me deal with my fertility challenges (PCOS), helps me find my identity as bisexual, etc. What he represents, what he has experience with, are things I'm experiencing myself or traits or values I share. Long story short, we have a lot in common. Even simpler - he's my patron god for pretty much the same reasons as anyone has a patron.

      I keep a shrine for him, upon which I maintain fresh offerings and where I regularly perform devotions (the most regular of which include reading hymns - modern and ancient - thanksgivings and occasionally asking for boons). I celebrate as many of his ancient festivals as I can and celebrate some festivals that I've taken from other devotees or that I've created. I'm usually working on at least one project for him, such as making a thyrsus, making masks and outdoor shrines, etc.
      The devotions I do change depending on what I feel like doing - sometimes I dance, sometimes I chant, meditate, have sex or get drunk (although that's rare because I just so happen to be a maenad that doesn't like the taste of wine), among a variety of other things.

      I should also add that my worship was influenced by Sannion and Kate Winter (both of these individuals have multiple websites; I just chose one to link to where you can find more on them); I encountered their work when I first began a relationship with Dionysos and I felt that the way I saw the god was similar to how they portrayed their experience with him. From what I've found, there are vastly different perceptions of the way Hellenic Paganism (recon, eclectic, and everything in between) should be practiced, and their ideals are the closest match to my own. Hellenic Recons, at least the ones I've met, and I don't have much... whatsoever... in common.

      Comment


        #4
        Re: Questions About Dionysos Worship

        Somewhere in the reading I've done in the past I ran into the idea that the Greeks used Dionysian revels to act as a sort of counterbalance to their rational/logical ideal state (maybe it was in Sailing the Wine Dark Sea: Why the greeks Matter, by Thomas Cahill).

        So I'm wondering - do you find that you do anything (or need to do anything) to balance out the wild Dionysian with a bit of the more orderly Apollonian?
        Every moment of a life is a horrible tragedy, a slapstick comedy, dark nihilism, golden illumination, or nothing at all; depending on how we write the story we tell ourselves.

        Comment


          #5
          Re: Questions About Dionysos Worship

          [quote author=B. de Corbin link=topic=70.msg1072#msg1072 date=1286796642]
          Somewhere in the reading I've done in the past I ran into the idea that the Greeks used Dionysian revels to act as a sort of counterbalance to their rational/logical ideal state (maybe it was in Sailing the Wine Dark Sea: Why the greeks Matter, by Thomas Cahill).

          So I'm wondering - do you find that you do anything (or need to do anything) to balance out the wild Dionysian with a bit of the more orderly Apollonian?
          [/quote]

          Part of the point of being Dionysos' devotee is the dedication to his ideals. Obviously, though, I'm not raving naked in the woods tearing apart wildlife and getting wasted and all those other things for which the ancient maenads are famous (well, ok, infamous).

          In the past, it was something I struggled with. How could it be that anyone could be fully devoted to him? Wouldn't it be incredibly self-destructive? But what I eventually came to understand is that Dionysos has more than one name because there's more to him than wine and madness. He is also Meilikhios, the Gentle, and Mantis, the Diviner, among dozens of others. He has a personality and he's shown me through my experiences that he cares for me - so it's a bit more than just being devoted to the most extreme things in life.

          Comment


            #6
            Re: Questions About Dionysos Worship

            [quote author=Raphaeline link=topic=70.msg1082#msg1082 date=1286801052]
            Part of the point of being Dionysus' devotee is the dedication to his ideals. Obviously, though, I'm not raving naked in the woods tearing apart wildlife and getting wasted and all those other things for which the ancient maenads are famous (well, ok, infamous)....[/quote]

            Which is good, otherwise your answers would be pretty incoherent ;D

            If I'm understanding this right, Dionysus seems to be like the deity of the border area between dark and light (by "dark and light" I don't mean good & evil - I mean more like between consciousness and unconsciousness, or between thought and feeling), where things can move easily from one side to the other. Does that make sense? Am I getting the idea?
            Every moment of a life is a horrible tragedy, a slapstick comedy, dark nihilism, golden illumination, or nothing at all; depending on how we write the story we tell ourselves.

            Comment


              #7
              Re: Questions About Dionysos Worship

              This does not have much to do with worship but I am quite curious about this, and I'm sorry if it's too personal or irrelevant, but: How did you know it was Dionysus? What was the main thing that made everything click or is that something that cannot really be answered?
              Wild Witchy Dusk | TwitterMy Art Blog | My Deviantart

              Comment


                #8
                Re: Questions About Dionysos Worship

                [quote author=B. de Corbin link=topic=70.msg1625#msg1625 date=1286887125]
                If I'm understanding this right, Dionysus seems to be like the deity of the border area between dark and light (by "dark and light" I don't mean good & evil - I mean more like between consciousness and unconsciousness, or between thought and feeling), where things can move easily from one side to the other. Does that make sense? Am I getting the idea?
                [/quote]

                This one's a little tricky.

                Dionysos, more than any other deity I've known, can morph from one god to another in magnificent ways. This is a god who will make you dance in the fire after lying you down in a field of lilies - so yes, his nature is both dark and light. However, in my experience, Dionysos does nothing by halves. He isn't gray. He can be mysterious, but it doesn't mean it's because he's straddling the line of all or nothing.

                If you're referring to something more like crossing from one side to the other, but not actually having a domain on that line itself, then yes, I'd say so. Dionysos very much represents crossing from one side to the other, traveling to one place from another place, passing through a doorway. He was born twice (some say three times), he traveled the world in a haze when Hera caused him to go mad, he descended into the underworld to rescue his mother and is considered an Olympian by some. Traversing from realm to realm, land to land, is something he's familiar with. He also moves from state to state through his many epithets - drunk and sober, dancing and lounging, divining and playing.

                Hopefully I answered your question sufficiently - not sure if I responded to exactly what you were asking! Am I kind of picking up Nietzschean feel to the questions?


                [quote author=LuciaStar link=topic=70.msg1670#msg1670 date=1286896009]
                This does not have much to do with worship but I am quite curious about this, and I'm sorry if it's too personal or irrelevant, but: How did you know it was Dionysus? What was the main thing that made everything click or is that something that cannot really be answered?
                [/quote]

                In the past, before I found him, I had other patrons that, although I called them patron, weren't actually deities I was close to. The way I found them was to try and describe what "god" and/or "goddess" meant to me (I was Wiccan at the time; this was years ago) and look for the god and goddess that matched that idea. It never worked out for me because I was using an infinitely broad concept of who these unknown people were, and using a limited selection to try and find them.

                Basically, to make a dating metaphor, I was dreaming up the perfect man, and then going to the clubs and becoming disappointed when I didn't find him.

                Instead, I looked at my options - I spent a while learning about different pantheons and deities from all over the world and tried to get to know them through their myths. Interestingly, Greek mythology was the only pantheon I decided I wasn't interested in at the beginning (probably because it seemed, in my childhood, that Greek mythology was the "popular" Pagan religion - we were always studying it in school and it was everyone's favorite). I just so happened to be watching a movie that mentioned his name, and that's what reminded me of him. I started reading about him. I found other people who worshiped him. I don't remember ever having a moment when I "introduced" myself because I'd always had some version of him present in my life - Horned God, Cernunnos, or someone similar to who I saw when I first found him.

                What set Dionysos apart from that is that he didn't seem to represent the preoccupation of being civilized. My kind of Paganism has to be primal, tribal, primitive for me to be happy. I need to feel free to dance naked around a bonfire, to feel that connection to the animal instinct in humanity, and Dionysos gave that to me - but he also gave me a link to other desires; motherly feelings, bisexuality, indulgence, luxury, excessiveness.

                All of that had a hand in my decision to devote myself to him, but a lot of it just came naturally. When I thought Isis was part of my path, I tried very hard to connect to her. I struggled to see her in meditation, but even when I could make her out, I never could get her to speak to me. I fought to connect to her somehow, but I finally had to realize there just was nothing between us. When I honor Ganesha, my secondary patron, there's a moment after a few mantra repetitions that I feel his presence at his shrine. But I feel Dionysos all the time. He never goes away.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Re: Questions About Dionysos Worship

                  [quote author=Raphaeline link=topic=70.msg1716#msg1716 date=1286903101]
                  Am I kind of picking up Nietzschean feel to the questions?
                  [/quote]

                  Yup -ish. I was pretty sure I understood what Nietzsche was describing in The Birth of Greek Tragedy (Apollonian vs. Dionysian approach), but the actual mythical Dionysus was a blank spot for me (I wasn't getting the idea from the little I knew about Dionysus), so I wasn't getting the full idea - you've helped me out a great deal. Thanks!
                  Every moment of a life is a horrible tragedy, a slapstick comedy, dark nihilism, golden illumination, or nothing at all; depending on how we write the story we tell ourselves.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Re: Questions About Dionysos Worship

                    [quote author=B. de Corbin link=topic=70.msg1735#msg1735 date=1286906607]
                    Yup -ish. I was pretty sure I understood what Nietzsche was describing in The Birth of Greek Tragedy (Apollonian vs. Dionysian approach), but the actual mythical Dionysus was a blank spot for me (I wasn't getting the idea from the little I knew about Dionysus), so I wasn't getting the full idea - you've helped me out a great deal. Thanks!
                    [/quote]

                    I'm ashamed to say I don't know enough about him, although I know a little about his thoughts on Dionysos. It's a process

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Re: Questions About Dionysos Worship

                      [quote author=Raphaeline link=topic=70.msg1716#msg1716 date=1286903101]
                      I don't remember ever having a moment when I "introduced" myself because I'd always had some version of him present in my life - Horned God, Cernunnos, or someone similar to who I saw when I first found him.[/quote]
                      This part peaks my interest a bit... how were they a version of him? Was it just the way they were perceived?
                      ...Sorry for the questions. D;

                      (I read your previous thread on the old forums, and I'm kind of glad to be about to ask some things on here now~ A lot of things you said back then caught my interest, and made me want to research Dionysus... and research I did, and found myself falling in love with a deity I once perceived as simply a god of wine. I find he's a quite interesting deity and the more I do read about him, the more I find him attractive.)
                      Wild Witchy Dusk | TwitterMy Art Blog | My Deviantart

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Re: Questions About Dionysos Worship

                        [quote author=LuciaStar link=topic=70.msg1801#msg1801 date=1286918641]
                        This part peaks my interest a bit... how were they a version of him? Was it just the way they were perceived?[/quote]
                        Oh, I mean just how I perceived them. I saw them as wild men, very tied into the animal side of humans. Others might not say that they have a lot in common, but when I first began to learn about Dionysos, he reminded me of them in a way.

                        ...Sorry for the questions. D;
                        No apologies necessary, I'm enjoying them!

                        (I read your previous thread on the old forums, and I'm kind of glad to be about to ask some things on here now~ A lot of things you said back then caught my interest, and made me want to research Dionysus... and research I did, and found myself falling in love with a deity I once perceived as simply a god of wine. I find he's a quite interesting deity and the more I do read about him, the more I find him attractive.)
                        I'd glad that it sparked your interest! If there's anything at all you want to ask, go right ahead; the questions are helpful to me, they give me new things to think about and a way to keep my brain from atrophying, lol...

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Re: Questions About Dionysos Worship

                          [quote author=Raphaeline link=topic=70.msg1807#msg1807 date=1286919368]
                          Oh, I mean just how I perceived them. I saw them as wild men, very tied into the animal side of humans. Others might not say that they have a lot in common, but when I first began to learn about Dionysos, he reminded me of them in a way.[/quote]
                          That makes a lot of sense when I think about it. Way back when, I tied the Horned God with sexuality and and saw him as a wild man.

                          No apologies necessary, I'm enjoying them!
                          I'd glad that it sparked your interest! If there's anything at all you want to ask, go right ahead; the questions are helpful to me, they give me new things to think about and a way to keep my brain from atrophying, lol...
                          Oh, okay. I'm glad you're enjoying them. I don't believe there's anything else I want to ask... yet but I'm pretty sure I'll come up with something. :P
                          Wild Witchy Dusk | TwitterMy Art Blog | My Deviantart

                          Comment


                            #14
                            Re: Dionysos Worship Q&A

                            Just wanted to include a link here to my ongoing devotional project, the image blog Where Dionysos Dwells.

                            Also, while I'm posting links...

                            Sannion's House of Vines blog (you should definitely RSS this one)
                            Wildivine's section on Dionysos
                            Dionysos' Theoi


                            I don't know if anyone remembers it from before the crash, but a member had posted a thread called something like "Walking with your God/Goddess". I'm still working on the project (which involves a comprehensive writing concerning a deity's correspondences, myths, symbols, pictures, songs, etc.) and I will be posting it here when I'm finished!

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Re: Questions About Dionysos Worship

                              [quote author=B. de Corbin link=topic=70.msg1735#msg1735 date=1286906607]
                              Yup -ish. I was pretty sure I understood what Nietzsche was describing in The Birth of Greek Tragedy (Apollonian vs. Dionysian approach), but the actual mythical Dionysus was a blank spot for me (I wasn't getting the idea from the little I knew about Dionysus), so I wasn't getting the full idea - you've helped me out a great deal. Thanks!
                              [/quote]

                              So...I'm just going to jump in here and thorw a bit of my own two cents here.

                              Personally, I think that if you're using this for your basis of understanding of Apollo and Dionysus, from what I understand about this book, you're missing a lot with respect to both gods. Now, full disclusure, I haven't read The Birth of Greek Tragedy myself (plan to one of these days) but from what I can tell, it seems to paint the two as being very much a set of polar opposites, a very either/or dichotomy whereas, in reality, Apollo is not strictly rational and civilized, while Dionysus is not without his much more restrained sides. I've got some interesting ideas about the relationship between Apollo and Dionysus...heh.

                              Have you ever had a look at the book The Greeks and the Irrational by ER Dodds? If not, you'll probably find that one interesting.
                              Memories of Pain and Light: http://painandlight.wordpress.com

                              "Hey love, I am a constant satellite of your blazing sun; my love, I obey your law of gravity, this is the fate you've carved on me, the law of gravity..." -Vienna Teng, Gravity

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X