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    To Spell or Not to Spell

    I'm breaking this off the 'To Do Evil' thread (located here) because I didn't want to derail it.

    When is it appropriate to use magic in the first place?

    [quote author=LiadanWillows link=topic=593.msg8594#msg8594 date=1288555205]
    Magic is not for rage, revenge, power or any negative thing, it is supposed to be used to connect you to the God/dess. Magic is to be used ONLY if mundane interventions do not work first!
    [/quote]

    This is a view I myself once held. I felt that magic was supposed to be only for last resorts, when all other solutions had failed. I don't know where, when or why I developed that notion. I don't remember anyone drilling it into my head, I don't remember getting it from any specific book. I just somehow thought that magic was a last ditch effort.

    I went for many years always trying to find mundane solutions to even the hardest, most obstinate, most difficult situations. I usually would beat myself silly before 'resorting' to magic, but it seemed like when I did use magic, it would work so well that I'd kick myself for not using it earlier. It finally sunk in that hey, there were no Magic Police out there who were going to arrest me for starting off with a spell or charm or something.

    I've come to the conclusion, over time, that magic is a tool. It's around to help people when they need a little extra 'something'. Maybe it'll make a resume more noticeable, maybe it'll help a civil servant to be more civil, give a little extra oomph to a marathon runner or during final exams. In other words, why not use magic to help solve problems or get better results when competing or performing?

    Now, I'm not saying to just cast spells and let things take care of themselves. You have to put in some practical work to help the magic do its job. Magic probably won't change a tire or get a beer from the fridge. I think there are limits, too. My oldest sister is the type of person who would cast a spell in hopes of it helping her get clean faster in the shower. I find myself eye-rolling at her a lot because I'm her main contact for information on correspondences and what-not, and I find myself asking, "you want a spell for what?!" more often than not.

    Any thoughts?
    Last edited by Ophidia; 30 Jan 2012, 08:37. Reason: Ending the apostropocalypse
    The forum member formerly known as perzephone. Or Perze. I've shed a skin.

    #2
    Re: To Spell or Not to Spell

    I pretty much agree with everything you said. Magic is just a tool and why wouldn't you use it if it helps. I think the problems start when people being to use magic instead of mundane means in order to solve their problems. As long as it is used in conjunction with more mundane methods I don't see the harm.
    http://thefeministpagan.blogspot.co.uk/

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      #3
      Re: To Spell or Not to Spell

      i fully agree Perzaphone. When I first started my path I was a little scared to do any actual spell-work...not because of my upbringing but because I could not wrap my mind around the mechanics of how it was done. Once I learned a bit about magical physics I started dabbling and then eventually began to use magic daily. Magic is a tool to help us in our daily lives and to many could be considered a way of life, not because its "the lazy way" of doing things, but IMHO a skill that all of us have and a skill that can be used to not only make our lives a little less treacherous of an ordeal, but also help us examine and find who we are, and who we can become.

      The reason I view magic this way is because there is no reason not to. There is nothing to stop anyone from this, though I have met a few teachers that teach magic as a last resort so their students don't go around performing spell-work without think of what they are asking for, i.e. asking to remove all things from his/her life that impede his/her magical study and growth, and then losing there job and family.
      If men had wings and bore black feathers, few of them would be clever enough to be crows. ---Henry Ward Beecher

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        #4
        Re: To Spell or Not to Spell

        I like spells and as a creative person, I feel like creating or adapting spells to "help" a situation fits with my nature. Whenever I actually do a spell, I always figure that I should be already doing some of the mundane things to achieve it (but I wouldn't beat myself down trying) and should continue to do so after the spell. After all what's the use of an attraction spell if I'm feeling antisocial or a spell to help me find a job if I haven't sent out applications? Kind of obvious examples but you get the idea

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          #5
          Re: To Spell or Not to Spell

          YAY I have been quoted!!! teehee. :P

          I don't know why I have always practiced this way. Trying mundane interventions first wasn't something that I had found anywhere either, it just feels right to me. I just don't want to be one of those people that choose to cast for every simple little thing. I understand that many people see magic as a tool. I instead see it as a gift given to me by the God/dess and I do not want to abuse it. I do not know where this philosophy comes from, it just feels right
          sigpic

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            #6
            Re: To Spell or Not to Spell

            I originally thought of magic as a last resort, that lasted only a month. Now I use magic whenever I have a realitly sound reason. Spells can't do everything but they can do alot
            Circe

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              #7
              Re: To Spell or Not to Spell

              In my experience there are two extremes - those who reach for a spell book at the slightest obstacle instead of looking for a sensible practical solution, and those who will do just about anything to avoid casting a spell at all.

              Me - I do magic as and when. It's a personal thing - if I feel it's right, and am willing to take any consequences, then I'll do it.

              The funny thing is though, that the better I got at magic, the less I need to do it.
              www.thewolfenhowlepress.com


              Phantom Turnips never die.... they just get stewed occasionally....

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                #8
                Re: To Spell or Not to Spell

                I'm quite in agreement, Perze (surprised?). And I think it depends on the path that one follows. If spellwork is just supposed to be nothing more than "white magic"? Well, you know where those folks would stand on banishings and hexes or curses... taboo. It's sort of an extreme example but the point, I think, is there. The bias comes from the relationship between magic use and religion, it seems.

                I mean, if there's some unwritten edict, in one's path, that forbids the use of such "evil spells" <cringe>, obviously they're going to feel a hell of a lot differently about it than someone like myself, that sees absolutely no difference in spells for good OR harm. If it feels appropriate? Use it.

                But, to quote Mrs. Penry:
                [quote author=Tylluan Penry link=topic=600.msg8752#msg8752 date=1288601332]
                The funny thing is though, that the better I got at magic, the less I need to do it.
                [/quote]

                This. Precisely.





                "Reason is not automatic. Those who deny it cannot be conquered by it." - Ayn Rand

                "Everything we hear is an opinion, not a fact. Everything we see is a perspective, not the truth." - Marcus Aurelius

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                  #9
                  Re: To Spell or Not to Spell

                  Magic is a tool, neither good nor evil. If you can walk over and change the TV channel, you don't need magic to do it for you. That's all anyone needs to consider in my mind. Use it when you need to but you don't need it on the mundane things.

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                    #10
                    Re: To Spell or Not to Spell

                    [quote author=Tylluan Penry link=topic=600.msg8752#msg8752 date=1288601332]
                    In my experience there are two extremes - those who reach for a spell book at the slightest obstacle instead of looking for a sensible practical solution, and those who will do just about anything to avoid casting a spell at all.

                    Me - I do magic as and when. It's a personal thing - if I feel it's right, and am willing to take any consequences, then I'll do it.

                    The funny thing is though, that the better I got at magic, the less I need to do it.
                    [/quote]

                    The only point here that I would disagree with is that I don't do less magic...............I do less spells and/or rituals. The magic is still there, its just used in different ways.

                    Which is why it annoyed the crap out of me when we had an invasion of people that used these boards and our members as spell encyclopedias.
                    Wonderful Life: The Burgess Shale and the Nature of HistoryPagan Devotionals, because the wind and the rain is our Bible
                    sigpic

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                      #11
                      Re: To Spell or Not to Spell

                      My idea of "magic" is somewhat different from the norm. To me, magic is getting the maximum result with the minimum effort, so a person does magic as much as possible - if he or she can.

                      I don't know much about spells, though. I guess my question would be "does it work?" - does it produce more with less effort, or does it require more effort to do less?
                      Every moment of a life is a horrible tragedy, a slapstick comedy, dark nihilism, golden illumination, or nothing at all; depending on how we write the story we tell ourselves.

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                        #12
                        Re: To Spell or Not to Spell

                        Magic is not for rage, revenge, power or any negative thing, it is supposed to be used to connect you to the God/dess. Magic is to be used ONLY if mundane interventions do not work first!
                        I've never understood why people sometimes make this into an "either/or" question. Often the best course is do whatever we can on the mundane level and also to "bless" or "boost" our efforts with magic. Sometimes it's a choice of one or the other, but sometimes both will be even more beneficial together.

                        There is a difference between revenge and justice. I would not use magic for revenge, but I have certainly used it to bring justice.

                        And there is also a difference between unthinking rage and directed anger. Anger can be a very potent power to charge our magic, just as desire can be a potent power. The trick is to balance the emotion with the clear-headed thought so we know what we're doing and why we're doing it and not just slugging the guy who accidentally bumped into us.


                        added: I rarely do spells, but I use magic fairly often, especially for healing work.
                        ------------------------


                        Of course I'm crazy, but that doesn't mean I'm wrong.
                        - robert anton wilson -

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                          #13
                          Re: To Spell or Not to Spell

                          I used to consider magic a last resort, mainly because that's what the Neo-Wicca books told me it was. But now I agree with most of you - it's a tool, I might as well use it to increase the chances that my efforts will come to fruition.

                          I don't even think it's wrong to work magic when you're in a rage - if it's done right. If you feel it's okay to fire off destruction rituals, so be it. But another spin you can take on it is to channel the rage into a vessel and give it to a god or an element or something to be recycled.
                          Children love and want to be loved and they very much prefer the joy of accomplishment to the triumph of hateful failure. Do not mistake a child for his symptom.
                          -Erik Erikson

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                            #14
                            Re: To Spell or Not to Spell

                            I see the use of magick as a daily event: my intent for something to happen (I want to feel better today, hey look at that I feel better), the medicines around me, use of nutritional and herbal healing to help myself, the alchemy around me (in the colours of things, my incenses, the transmutation processes going on around me, etc), energy control while working on my martial sword form, energy into cooking, trances that happen through out the day, the fetishes in my shrine, etc.

                            When aware how it applies to life and how things can be affected by solely a wardrobe change (going to a meeting why not use alchemy and go saturnal in your colours, what's wrong with having some black for banishing negativity and purple for domination?) you do magick without thinking about it.

                            I do my rituals as I should per my practice (as much as I can, sometimes health factors will get in the way), but for extra spell work I do that when mundane measures have failed. I don't feel the need to seek deity assistance for every little issue, but when it's to the point modern psychological measures can't seem to help, then I'll cast for resolution. Sometimes the cast is to aid what I'm using not to resolve the problem out right.
                            -=Ex Ignorantia Ad Sapientiam; E Luce Ad Tenebras=-

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                              #15
                              Re: To Spell or Not to Spell

                              I haven't cast spells for a long time either and life indeed is mundane! lets change it up.. I am in the same boat! TO SPELL I SAY!! TO SPELL! -properly of course-

                              ---------- Post added at 09:06 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:05 PM ----------

                              clive i agree, it is a last resort

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