The Elder Futhark has become very common in pagan circles. However, I've found that very few people hold to the traditional methods of creating runes. For example, wood and bone have been replaced by beans and seeds. Not only have the materials changed but so too has the tradition of blooding runes. A lot of Neo-Pagans think blood is taboo because it causes pain etc so they just ignore it. Others are just completely ignorant of the tradition and its origins in the Eddas. Another thing I've seen is the belief that the runes can't be used to harm someone. Anyone who knows anything about Germanic paganism knows that's a lie. Nidstangs and other curse poles are proof to the contrary. So what do you all think?
Announcement
Collapse
No announcement yet.
Runes
Collapse
X
-
Sr. Member
- Dec 2011
- 351
- Modern Constructionist Germanic Heathen with Shamanic Tendencies
- female
- West Coast Canada
- You know what it takes, so do it.
Re: Runes
I use accent beads because a) they are easy to work on with my dremel b) they are easily accessible, where fruit tree wood and boon is not for me and c) they appeal to my inner magpie.
If a set is for my use alone, I DO blood them, mixing the blood in with the paint.
Myself, I'm not a reconstructionist. I'm a modern constructionist. Using what works in a modern setting is my thing. But it's MY thing, not necessarily anyone else's and I'm okay with that.
-
Re: Runes
Not everyone has researched the origin of the Runes thoroughly to know everything all at once, and not everyone upon learning the stories will choose to adhere to them. People will follow their own ways, it's an impossibility to try to control the thoughts and behaviors of other people.
I know several people who began using the runes before they knew where they came from because they were drawn to them; it wasn't until several years down the line when they started to actually research the stories and start to progress their understanding. Everything is a process.
Comment
-
Re: Runes
A perusal of three different translations (Bellows, Thorpe and Chisholm... my Hollander and Larrington are packed away somewhere) of the pertinent stanza of the Havamal shows one referral to blood (note: the most recent translation), one uses the word tint, and one seems to ignore it entirely (as an aside, all three are available at www.heathengods.com as free legal downloads). I've also seen this interpreted as 'stain' and as 'redden.' Apparently, there is little consensus among the scholars. I seem to recall a demo-type video by the late Sveinbjorn of the Icelandic Asatruarfelig (sp?) where he used saliva on runes (from the stained school, it would seem).
As to materials, we have a few examples of wood, horn, bone, walrus ivory, sword blades and hilts, and helmets carved with runes, but obviously that simply means we don't have examples of any other materials not recorded in a Saga, or archaeologically unearthed. We can't say absolutely that shells, beans, seeds, beads, etc were NOT used. Other than an inference by Tacitus (who doesn't say what was carved on slips of wood from a fruit-bearing tree), there is no evidence of rune-casting (as we understand the term today) for divination. The Sagas do cite bird's flight patterns, cloud patterns (or maybe weather patterns), and stallion fights as divination tools.
All that said, our Ancestors were resourceful and adaptive. In my opinion, if polymer clay had been available to them, someone would have carved runes in it.
I have made rune sets in many types of wood, in bone, horn, shell, polymer clay and the glass pebbles that are used in fish bowls. In a pinch, I've made a set cut from pasteboard squares. They all worked equally well. I stained my own birch runes, but would never stain runes made for someone else (well... unless I nick myself... ).I often wish that I had done drugs in the '70s. At least there'd be a reason for the flashbacks. - Rick the Runesinger
Blood and CountryTribe of my Tribe
Clan of my Clan
Kin of my Kin
Blood of my Blood
For the Yule was upon them, the Yule; and they quaffed from the skulls of the slain,
And shouted loud oaths in hoarse wit, and long quaffing swore laughing again.
Comment
-
Re: Runes
My runes are hematite. Because its beautiful and sings to me. I didn't make them, I bought them, but neither me nor my runes care. I haven't blooded them, because it hasn't been necessary. perhaps one day.ThorSon's milkshake brings all the PF girls to the yard - Volcaniclastic
RIP
I have never been across the way
Seen the desert and the birds
You cut your hair short
Like a shush to an insult
The world had been yelling
Since the day you were born
Revolting with anger
While it smiled like it was cute
That everything was shit.
- J. Wylder
Comment
-
Opinionated
- Jun 2013
- 2447
- Northern Tradition Shaminist Demonolator. Or something along those lines...
- female
- Adelaide, Australia
Re: Runes
I'm gonna quote Rick first, because he said something that is always the first thing I bring up when people start talking about the historical use of the runes...
Originally posted by Rick View PostOther than an inference by Tacitus (who doesn't say what was carved on slips of wood from a fruit-bearing tree), there is no evidence of rune-casting (as we understand the term today) for divination. The Sagas do cite bird's flight patterns, cloud patterns (or maybe weather patterns), and stallion fights as divination tools.
Having said that... I am not for one second suggesting that we should not use the runes for magick or divination. I do it all the time... and very successfully. I just want to bring a bit of perspective the the 'historical usage' debate. I've heard all sorts of rules and regulations about the use of the runes over the years... and the reality is that most of it has no historical basis at all.
Obviously the runespirits are working with people today. So regardless of what may or may not have happened thousands of years ago, things are happening today that seem to be pretty valid.
Originally posted by Claude View PostThe Elder Futhark has become very common in pagan circles. However, I've found that very few people hold to the traditional methods of creating runes. For example, wood and bone have been replaced by beans and seeds.
The Runatal section of the Havamal has a lovely little verse that has been translated a dozen different ways, as Rick pointed out. And it says nothing about materials.
Personally, I am in the process of making a rune set out of semi-precious stones. Each stone was chosen intuitively in consultation with the runespirit it will be the vessel for. This is very much a non-traditional method, but it seems to be working just fine.
Originally posted by Claude View PostNot only have the materials changed but so too has the tradition of blooding runes. A lot of Neo-Pagans think blood is taboo because it causes pain etc so they just ignore it. Others are just completely ignorant of the tradition and its origins in the Eddas.
Originally posted by Claude View PostAnother thing I've seen is the belief that the runes can't be used to harm someone. Anyone who knows anything about Germanic paganism knows that's a lie. Nidstangs and other curse poles are proof to the contrary. So what do you all think?
Comment
-
Silver Member
- Oct 2010
- 3338
- solitary pagan witch with a strong interest in Anglo Saxons
- South Wales Valleys, UK
- Phantom Turnips never die. They just get stewed occasionally....
Re: Runes
And Tacitus does not even mention runes, but uses the Latin word for signs instead.
One thing I feel is fun to add here though is that there was actually a charm that was supposed to plague the victim’s belly with ‘crapulence and wind’ and ‘great flatulence’ so that ‘farting may never stop, neither by day nor by night.’
There are apparently fart runes in the Icelandic Galdrabok, and at Bergen in Norway a medieval rune stick was found with runic fart charm on it. You’ll love the translation for that one, it says:
Sit down and interpret the runes; rise up and fart!
Comment
-
Opinionated
- Jun 2013
- 2447
- Northern Tradition Shaminist Demonolator. Or something along those lines...
- female
- Adelaide, Australia
Re: Runes
Originally posted by Tylluan Penry View PostAnd Tacitus does not even mention runes, but uses the Latin word for signs instead.
One thing I feel is fun to add here though is that there was actually a charm that was supposed to plague the victim’s belly with ‘crapulence and wind’ and ‘great flatulence’ so that ‘farting may never stop, neither by day nor by night.’
There are apparently fart runes in the Icelandic Galdrabok, and at Bergen in Norway a medieval rune stick was found with runic fart charm on it. You’ll love the translation for that one, it says:
Sit down and interpret the runes; rise up and fart!
That's brilliant.
Comment
-
Re: Runes
Understand that I ask these questions knowing only two things about runes: 1. Everyone at the local gathering spot is all aflutter about them. 2. I know how to spell "rune". Other than that, I know nothing. I ask in order to learn.
Originally posted by Rae'ya View Post... The only thing that we know for sure about the historical use of the runes is that they were an alphabet that was carved on stones and jewelry. There is no evidence of them being used in divination, and there isn't even anything 100% equivocal that proves they were used as a magickal alphabet...
Obviously the runespirits are working with people today. So regardless of what may or may not have happened thousands of years ago, things are happening today that seem to be pretty valid.
Again, I'm sure that there is a lot that I'm not understanding, so please forgive me if I sound ignorant (because I am).
Comment
-
Re: Runes
Originally posted by Tarn View PostUnderstand that I ask these questions knowing only two things about runes: 1. Everyone at the local gathering spot is all aflutter about them. 2. I know how to spell "rune". Other than that, I know nothing. I ask in order to learn.
The way this reads, I get the impression that runes were not used in ancient times? If that is the case, why do I recall hearing about them being used in "the days of old" and such? I'm sure I'm missing something here, just not sure what it is.
If what I understand is correct, and runes were not used in ancient times: did the runespirits exist back then but were not heard of because no one call upon them? Or did they come into being, kind of like an egregore, when the need for them arose?
Again, I'm sure that there is a lot that I'm not understanding, so please forgive me if I sound ignorant (because I am).
What Rae'ya and I are saying is that there is no definitive historical evidence that runes were used for divination. There is definitive historical evidence that runes were used for magic, as related throughout various of the Sagas and in books like the Galdrabok.I often wish that I had done drugs in the '70s. At least there'd be a reason for the flashbacks. - Rick the Runesinger
Blood and CountryTribe of my Tribe
Clan of my Clan
Kin of my Kin
Blood of my Blood
For the Yule was upon them, the Yule; and they quaffed from the skulls of the slain,
And shouted loud oaths in hoarse wit, and long quaffing swore laughing again.
Comment
-
Re: Runes
Originally posted by Rick View PostRunes were indeed used in ancient times. For a brief history of runes, go here: http://www.paganforum.com/showthread...story-of-Runes
What Rae'ya and I are saying is that there is no definitive historical evidence that runes were used for divination. There is definitive historical evidence that runes were used for magic, as related throughout various of the Sagas and in books like the Galdrabok.
Comment
-
Opinionated
- Jun 2013
- 2447
- Northern Tradition Shaminist Demonolator. Or something along those lines...
- female
- Adelaide, Australia
Re: Runes
Originally posted by Tarn View PostThe way this reads, I get the impression that runes were not used in ancient times? If that is the case, why do I recall hearing about them being used in "the days of old" and such? I'm sure I'm missing something here, just not sure what it is.
Originally posted by Tarn View PostIf what I understand is correct, and runes were not used in ancient times: did the runespirits exist back then but were not heard of because no one call upon them? Or did they come into being, kind of like an egregore...
Comment
Comment