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    Re: Atheism vs Anti-theism

    Hey B.De.,kinda liking the quote you have in your sig...

    "It is possible that mankind is on the threshold of a golden age; but, if so, it will be necessary first to slay the dragon that guards the door, and this dragon is religion. Bertrand Russell"
    MAGIC is MAGIC,black OR white or even blood RED

    all i ever wanted was a normal life and love.
    NO TERF EVER WE belong Too.
    don't stop the tears.let them flood your soul.




    sigpic

    my new page here,let me know what you think.


    nothing but the shadow of what was

    witchvox
    http://www.witchvox.com/vu/vxposts.html

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      Re: Atheism vs Anti-theism

      Originally posted by Seeking a Religion View Post
      Wont you please tell us then : How did highly personal ,intelligent entities , information-laden effects come from unwilled/undirected/non intelligent raw materials and chemicals like hydrogen, helium, planets, stars, etc ? Tell us how DNA with its vast information density with specified complexity enough to fill 1,000 volumes of encyclopedias from a one celled amoeba (per atheist Richard Dawkins) came from dead chemicals ? This isn't my opinion....rather it is scientifically impossible . Back in the early 1980's when the Pet Rock phenomenon was in full force, my Pet Rock didn't do squat for me by way of communicating --- it just took up dead space and my mom made me clean the thing weekly cause it was just a dust collector...and oversized paper weight.

      Atheism is the least possible worldviews out of all ; it requires one be illogical for the sake of enjoying no ultimate moral culpability by way of lifestyle choices. Eliminate a personal moral creator and virtually everything is permissible.
      Tell me, then: Using science, explain how a God could exist. What is a god comprised of? Do they follow the law of conservation of energy and mass? Do they weigh anything? Using science, tell me how they created us. Are we but play-doh pawns to the will of the universe, easily shaped, and molded, and not held accountable for our own evolutionary path?

      As per your rock example: a rock is a rock. A rock is not composed of cells. A rock is composed of minerals. No matter how many googly eyes you paste onto your rock, at the end of the day, your rock is a rock. It neither multiplies, nor divides its molecular structure, and the only way for it to change its nature is through erosion, weathering, or temperature pressure changes. It cannot become pregnant, it cannot starve, it cannot adapt to the environment around it, except through the above mentioned factors.

      Do not speak of what you do not know.

      for more reading, please see this article on how scientists believe matter was formed


      Mostly art.

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        Re: Atheism vs Anti-theism

        Originally posted by Seeking a Religion View Post
        Atheism is the least possible worldviews out of all ; it requires one be illogical for the sake of enjoying no ultimate moral culpability by way of lifestyle choices. Eliminate a personal moral creator and virtually everything is permissible.
        Actually, no. Atheism is simply a lack of belief in a higher power. Most atheists don't state "I know there is no God", because it's not a provable fact (some will, of course, but not the majority). Many atheists choose to look at science for their worldview, but not all do. The assertion that there's no moral culpability just because you don't have a spiritual code to refer to is both absurd and insulting.

        Your society still has secular laws to adhere to, many of them similar to common moral codes in religions (don't steal, don't lie, don't hurt other people). Beyond that, even as a spiritual person, I know that it's not my spirituality that gives me morals--it's my own knowledge of what is right and wrong based on how an issue would affect me and other people.

        The common argument is that "if you're an atheist, you'd go out and murder all of the people you wanted to". Well, if I lost all of my spiritual beliefs and this were true, I still wouldn't want to murder anyone. If you have this mindset and it's only a higher power that's keeping your killing spree in check, you need therapy, not a god.
        Army of Darkness: Guardians of the Chat

        Honorary Nord.

        Habbalah Vlogs

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          Re: Atheism vs Anti-theism

          Originally posted by habbalah View Post
          Actually, no. Atheism is simply a lack of belief in a higher power. Most atheists don't state "I know there is no God", because it's not a provable fact (some will, of course, but not the majority). Many atheists choose to look at science for their worldview, but not all do. The assertion that there's no moral culpability just because you don't have a spiritual code to refer to is both absurd and insulting.

          Your society still has secular laws to adhere to, many of them similar to common moral codes in religions (don't steal, don't lie, don't hurt other people). Beyond that, even as a spiritual person, I know that it's not my spirituality that gives me morals--it's my own knowledge of what is right and wrong based on how an issue would affect me and other people.

          The common argument is that "if you're an atheist, you'd go out and murder all of the people you wanted to". Well, if I lost all of my spiritual beliefs and this were true, I still wouldn't want to murder anyone. If you have this mindset and it's only a higher power that's keeping your killing spree in check, you need therapy, not a god.
          Exactly! No religion and no personal morals has absolutely nothing to do with each other. If the lack of a god makes you think it's ok to hurt someone something is wrong, but it has nothing to do with religion. I don't abstain from killing for fear of judgement, I don't kill because it goes against myself and my own feelings of right and wrong.
          You remind me of the babe
          What babe?
          The babe with the power
          What power?
          The Power of voodoo
          Who do?
          You do!
          Do what?
          Remind me of the babe!

          Army of Darkness: Guardians of the Chat

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            Re: Atheism vs Anti-theism

            Originally posted by B. de Corbin View Post
            Yup - I suppose it is... right up to the point where one begins to understand chemistry & chemical reactions, physics and the effects of physical processes, or evolution...

            *emphasis added.
            Lol...

            Amazingly, I'm a scientist with a degree in biology and I'm (mostly) a theist...AND I have absolutely no problem with how life can arise from non-life.

            Because, ya know, I understand the multiple models.




            I love this kind of ignorant poop beyond all words.

            Religious people must be weird - if they suddenly became atheists, they are convinced that they will begin raping their daughters, and prostituting their sons...

            Uhm... people like this, apparently, do need God to tell them how to be human.

            ditto
            Wonderful Life: The Burgess Shale and the Nature of HistoryPagan Devotionals, because the wind and the rain is our Bible
            sigpic

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              Re: Atheism vs Anti-theism

              If I was a Christian there'd be nothing to stop me from selling my daughter as a slave. (Exodus - 21:7-11)
              Trust is knowing someone or something well enough to have a good idea of their motivations and character, for good or for ill. People often say trust when they mean faith.

              Comment


                Re: Atheism vs Anti-theism

                Originally posted by Seeking a Religion View Post
                Modern science has proven that the universe had a cause and when you look at what kind of cause it had to have been based on the effects we have, it is clear to the reasonable Mind that it had to be personal . The multiverse speculation is completely unprovable and imaginary because it doesn't deal with the reality we have. When we examine what we do have by way of effects from the Creation event (our reality today) , we can get a very accurate idea of what the First Cause had to be ; The First Cause must be self existent, timeless, nonspatial, immaterial since the First Cause created time, space, and matter and he is without limits and is infinite . The first cause of anything that becomes finite, must be infinite or outside of what is created much like a Painter is to his Painting. The First Cause would have to unimaginably powerful to create the entire Universe out of nothing and supremely intelligent to design the Universe with incredible precision . The Cause would have to be personal in order to choose to convert a state of nothingness into the time-space-material universe, for, an impersonal force has no ability to make choices. These characteristics of the First Cause are exactly the characteristics ascribe to God and they are NOT someones religion or subjective experience...rather they are drawn from the scientific evidence which IS our reality .

                'Religion is definitely not a source for good....' : Including the sociological fallout of religious secular humanism based on its affirmations found in Manifesto 1 and 2.
                This is an excellent theory, but it's not backed up by science. Yes, I am an atheist. No, I do not believe in any gods. Yes, I believe that religion is the most evil scourge to ever afflict the earth... but I don't assert that the universe is proven to be anything other than what we know it to be. We do not know the origin of the universe and therefore we do not know the 'intent' of it's 'creation.'

                While I agree with a lot of your perspective, I do not agree that it is concrete fact.

                Let me be clear, I am not trying to discourage you from posting on this thread and sharing your thoughts, just know the difference between making philosophical hypotheses and scientific fact.

                - - - Updated - - -

                Originally posted by Seeking a Religion View Post
                Wont you please tell us then : How did highly personal ,intelligent entities , information-laden effects come from unwilled/undirected/non intelligent raw materials and chemicals like hydrogen, helium, planets, stars, etc ? Tell us how DNA with its vast information density with specified complexity enough to fill 1,000 volumes of encyclopedias from a one celled amoeba (per atheist Richard Dawkins) came from dead chemicals ? This isn't my opinion....rather it is scientifically impossible . Back in the early 1980's when the Pet Rock phenomenon was in full force, my Pet Rock didn't do squat for me by way of communicating --- it just took up dead space and my mom made me clean the thing weekly cause it was just a dust collector...and oversized paper weight.

                Atheism is the least possible worldviews out of all ; it requires one be illogical for the sake of enjoying no ultimate moral culpability by way of lifestyle choices. Eliminate a personal moral creator and virtually everything is permissible.
                "This isn't my opinion, rather it is scientifically impossible."

                Since we're in the habit of being snarky, please enlighten me as to your scientific education and contributions to the scientific community. To assert such claims requires more evidence than opinion and couch-philosophy.

                - - - Updated - - -

                Originally posted by volcaniclastic View Post
                Tell me, then: Using science, explain how a God could exist. What is a god comprised of? Do they follow the law of conservation of energy and mass? Do they weigh anything? Using science, tell me how they created us. Are we but play-doh pawns to the will of the universe, easily shaped, and molded, and not held accountable for our own evolutionary path?

                As per your rock example: a rock is a rock. A rock is not composed of cells. A rock is composed of minerals. No matter how many googly eyes you paste onto your rock, at the end of the day, your rock is a rock. It neither multiplies, nor divides its molecular structure, and the only way for it to change its nature is through erosion, weathering, or temperature pressure changes. It cannot become pregnant, it cannot starve, it cannot adapt to the environment around it, except through the above mentioned factors.

                Do not speak of what you do not know.

                for more reading, please see this article on how scientists believe matter was formed
                It is not possible to love you any harder.
                No one tells the wind which way to blow.

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                  Re: Atheism vs Anti-theism

                  Just so we all know. I do have morals. I mean, I won't eat a baby if I dropped it on the floor past the 5 second mark. Pft. I'm not a barbarian.
                  Satan is my spirit animal

                  Comment


                    Re: Atheism vs Anti-theism

                    Originally posted by Medusa View Post
                    Just so we all know. I do have morals. I mean, I won't eat a baby if I dropped it on the floor past the 5 second mark. Pft. I'm not a barbarian.
                    And not without the right sauce.
                    Army of Darkness: Guardians of the Chat

                    Honorary Nord.

                    Habbalah Vlogs

                    Comment


                      Re: Atheism vs Anti-theism

                      Originally posted by Medusa View Post
                      Just so we all know. I do have morals. I mean, I won't eat a baby if I dropped it on the floor past the 5 second mark. Pft. I'm not a barbarian.
                      Same as V goes for you.
                      No one tells the wind which way to blow.

                      Comment


                        Re: Atheism vs Anti-theism

                        Originally posted by Medusa View Post
                        Just so we all know. I do have morals. I mean, I won't eat a baby if I dropped it on the floor past the 5 second mark. Pft. I'm not a barbarian.
                        You just made my day!
                        You remind me of the babe
                        What babe?
                        The babe with the power
                        What power?
                        The Power of voodoo
                        Who do?
                        You do!
                        Do what?
                        Remind me of the babe!

                        Army of Darkness: Guardians of the Chat

                        Comment

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