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    Connections with Goddesses, but no Gods.......

    hi all!
    i am confused about something here, and am not quite sure which tradition i exactly fit into anymore.....please help!

    i have always been in love with the Greek pantheon, and have a couple of Greek patron Goddesses that i work well with and work regularly with.
    however, i am not attracted to ANY of the Greek Gods, or any Gods that i know of......i have tried meditating and visualizing, but....nothing.
    so, i have no patron God. this bothers me, because i feel like that should make my practices off-balance.....however, it doesn't seem to.
    it's not that i don't like any of the Gods.....i just feel absolutely NO connection to any of them.
    i would not consider myself a Dianic Witch......but at the same time, what do you all think?

    thanks for your input,
    B

    #2
    Re: Connections with Goddesses, but no Gods.......

    Sometimes people mainly have connections to goddess. Or gods. Or deities with rabbit tails. Or lion heads. That's kind of just how it goes. Fwiw, my practices have been 99% goddess-centered and the only place imbalance ever came from was from me and how I pictured things working in my head.

    That said, there's really nothing stopping you from picking a god you like a lot and starting devotions. Sometimes you have to go to a deity first before you connect.
    Blog: http://thestarsafire.tumblr.com

    Kuchi wa wazawai no moto (the mouth is the origin of disasters)

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      #3
      Re: Connections with Goddesses, but no Gods.......

      I think that balanced pairings in all is primarily a Wiccan legacy (and not necessarily relevant outside certain Wiccan circles) and that if a god wants you then they'll let you know at a time and place of their choosing.
      life itself was a lightsaber in his hands; even in the face of treachery and death and hopes gone cold, he burned like a candle in the darkness. Like a star shining in the black eternity of space.

      Yoda: Dark Rendezvous

      "But those men who know anything at all about the Light also know that there is a fierceness to its power, like the bare sword of the law, or the white burning of the sun." Suddenly his voice sounded to Will very strong, and very Welsh. "At the very heart, that is. Other things, like humanity, and mercy, and charity, that most good men hold more precious than all else, they do not come first for the Light. Oh, sometimes they are there; often, indeed. But in the very long run the concern of you people is with the absolute good, ahead of all else..."

      John Rowlands, The Grey King by Susan Cooper

      "You come from the Lord Adam and the Lady Eve", said Aslan. "And that is both honour enough to erect the head of the poorest beggar, and shame enough to bow the shoulders of the greatest emperor on earth; be content."

      Aslan, Prince Caspian by CS Lewis


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        #4
        Re: Connections with Goddesses, but no Gods.......

        Dianic points to Roman not Hellenic in practice.

        The other thing you have to consider is there is right practice and right focus which are not the same thing. Figure for most of the Hellenic practices its about right practice and right living not about right focus which tends to be about the self.
        I'm Only Responsible For What I Say Not For What Or How You Understand!

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          #5
          Re: Connections with Goddesses, but no Gods.......

          Originally posted by Satu View Post
          Sometimes people mainly have connections to goddess. Or gods. Or deities with rabbit tails. Or lion heads. That's kind of just how it goes. Fwiw, my practices have been 99% goddess-centered and the only place imbalance ever came from was from me and how I pictured things working in my head.
          i am the same way, probably 99% of my workings are Goddess-based......with that in mind, should i even consider myself Wiccan? or something else?

          - - - Updated - - -

          Originally posted by monsno_leedra View Post
          Dianic points to Roman not Hellenic in practice.
          thank you for that clarification.....i really wasn't sure!

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            #6
            Re: Connections with Goddesses, but no Gods.......

            Originally posted by GrantGirl23 View Post
            thank you for that clarification.....i really wasn't sure!
            Looking at Dianic it also tends to point you more to the Reclamist type practices by Starhawk or some of the things by Z Buddapest more than a Roman or Hellenic based practice. Though I suppose you could fall into a Stregian type practice as well as Diana plays a rather large part there as well.
            I'm Only Responsible For What I Say Not For What Or How You Understand!

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              #7
              Re: Connections with Goddesses, but no Gods.......

              Originally posted by GrantGirl23 View Post
              i am the same way, probably 99% of my workings are Goddess-based......with that in mind, should i even consider myself Wiccan? or something else?
              If I recollect, a Wiccan is someone who honors both a God and Goddess (someone correct me, please, if I'm way off base). If that doesn't describe you at all, then maybe you should look into other titles like eclectic pagan, or even witch, if that fits what you do.

              If you still honor a God at the appropriate times, then you're probably okay, or you could even call yourself "goddess-focused", if you wanted to be more specific.

              Mostly it's going to come down to your personal opinion, what you feel is right, etc.
              Last edited by Satu; 07 Oct 2014, 19:35. Reason: broke a quote tag
              Blog: http://thestarsafire.tumblr.com

              Kuchi wa wazawai no moto (the mouth is the origin of disasters)

              Comment


                #8
                Re: Connections with Goddesses, but no Gods.......

                Originally posted by GrantGirl23 View Post
                hi all!
                i am confused about something here, and am not quite sure which tradition i exactly fit into anymore.....please help!

                i have always been in love with the Greek pantheon, and have a couple of Greek patron Goddesses that i work well with and work regularly with.
                however, i am not attracted to ANY of the Greek Gods, or any Gods that i know of......i have tried meditating and visualizing, but....nothing.
                so, i have no patron God. this bothers me, because i feel like that should make my practices off-balance.....however, it doesn't seem to.
                it's not that i don't like any of the Gods.....i just feel absolutely NO connection to any of them.
                i would not consider myself a Dianic Witch......but at the same time, what do you all think?

                thanks for your input,
                B
                The dichotomous combination of patron god and patron goddess is largely a Wiccan and neo-Wiccan thing. But there are a number of neo-Wiccans nowdays that are not adhering so strictly to the 'balance' that was once so important. There are also a great many neo-Wiccans who simply pay lip service to a 'patron' god while wholly working with goddesses, and vice versa. In my experience, outside of neo-Wicca, the soft-poly duothestic thing is much less common than you would thing. There are many of us who don't believe that you must work with both a god and a goddess in order to be 'balanced'. There are many of us who believe that dichotomous 'balance' is overrated.

                Originally posted by monsno_leedra View Post
                Dianic points to Roman not Hellenic in practice.
                Actually, Dianic Wicca, while named for a Roman goddess, is not a Roman based practice at all. It was founded by Z Budapest and is (was) a reflection of her extreme feminist ideals. It has evolved over the years, but it is still at it's core, Z Budapest's tradition. Aside from being purely goddess based, it has no specific loyalties to any one pantheon.

                - - - Updated - - -

                Originally posted by Satu View Post
                If I recollect, a Wiccan is someone who honors both a God and Goddess (someone correct me, please, if I'm way off base).
                Once upon a time, yes. Neo-Wicca has evolved quite a bit, though. There are ALL sorts of neo-Wiccans nowdays. Not all of them honor a God and a Goddess equally. Even 18 years ago, when I was passing through a neo-Wiccan stage, there was theoretical emphasis on this balance, but quite a bit of leeway in practice. A lot of our contemporary neo-Wiccan writers are goddess-centered in reality, while keeping the 'God' part as a formality invoked in full ritual only. The Goddess often has a face, while the God has little more than an arbitrarily picked name. Call me a cynic, but it's one of the reasons I passed through neo-Wicca quickly.

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                  #9
                  Re: Connections with Goddesses, but no Gods.......

                  Originally posted by Rae'ya View Post
                  ..Actually, Dianic Wicca, while named for a Roman goddess, is not a Roman based practice at all. It was founded by Z Budapest and is (was) a reflection of her extreme feminist ideals. It has evolved over the years, but it is still at it's core, Z Budapest's tradition. Aside from being purely goddess based, it has no specific loyalties to any one pantheon. ..
                  That's where it gets interesting. To my understanding Z. Budapest is credited with creating Dianic Witchcraft which is not specifically Dianic Wicca. Yet many people it seems have taken to calling it Dianic Wicca sort of similar to how many call Starhawk's Reclaiming movement Wicca versus goddess worship. Then on some occasions you hear Stregia in a folk practice referred to as Dianic as Aradia is supposed to be the daughter of Diana and creates the connection to some forms of Stregia which is Roman or Italian though not based upon that pantheon.

                  So its not so simple as just saying Dianic is Wiccan, feminist or the sole creation of Z. Budapest. But in general I do agree that most often it is equated to Z. Budapest's extreme view of feminism and is very much anti-male and anti-transgender.
                  I'm Only Responsible For What I Say Not For What Or How You Understand!

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                    #10
                    Re: Connections with Goddesses, but no Gods.......

                    Originally posted by monsno_leedra View Post
                    That's where it gets interesting. To my understanding Z. Budapest is credited with creating Dianic Witchcraft which is not specifically Dianic Wicca. Yet many people it seems have taken to calling it Dianic Wicca sort of similar to how many call Starhawk's Reclaiming movement Wicca versus goddess worship. Then on some occasions you hear Stregia in a folk practice referred to as Dianic as Aradia is supposed to be the daughter of Diana and creates the connection to some forms of Stregia which is Roman or Italian though not based upon that pantheon.

                    So its not so simple as just saying Dianic is Wiccan, feminist or the sole creation of Z. Budapest. But in general I do agree that most often it is equated to Z. Budapest's extreme view of feminism and is very much anti-male and anti-transgender.
                    Nope, she's credited with Dianic Wicca, Dianic Wicca and (even though Wikipedia is a terrible source it demonstrates my point) Dianic Wicca.

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                      #11
                      Re: Connections with Goddesses, but no Gods.......

                      Originally posted by Rae'ya View Post
                      Nope, she's credited with Dianic Wicca, Dianic Wicca and (even though Wikipedia is a terrible source it demonstrates my point) Dianic Wicca.
                      Sorry doesn't disprove what I said as early works say Dianic Witchcraft or Dianic Witch. The first two referenced links, ok the same site but two different pages, say Dianic Wicca Witchcraft. Though this paragraph says it the best.

                      The result of the creation of the McFarland Dianic tradition has been that the original Dianic tradition has had to redefine itself to distance itself from theMcFarlands. Thus, you will see reference to the Feminist Wicca, Feminist Dianic, Feminist Tradition and Feminist Witchcraft, which are all the same as Z Budapest’s women-centered, all female Dianic tradition.
                      I'm Only Responsible For What I Say Not For What Or How You Understand!

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Re: Connections with Goddesses, but no Gods.......

                        Originally posted by monsno_leedra View Post
                        Sorry doesn't disprove what I said as early works say Dianic Witchcraft or Dianic Witch. The first two referenced links, ok the same site but two different pages, say Dianic Wicca Witchcraft. Though this paragraph says it the best.
                        Hon, you're arguing semantics. Aside from which, you actually said that: "To my understanding Z. Budapest is credited with creating Dianic Witchcraft which is not specifically Dianic Wicca'. Patently, Z Budapest herself, as well as her adherents, consider that her Dianic Wicca is the same as her Dianic Witchcraft. You claim that Z Budapest's tradition is not Dianic Wicca. My sources say otherwise.

                        Find me a source that explicitly says that Dianic Wicca was not created by Z Budapest and I might pay attention. And no, your quote doesn't count. Because a) it's a quote, not a source; and b) the McFarland Dianic Tradition IS NOT Dianic Wicca... which means that your quote actually doesn't support your personal theory at all.

                        Otherwise, I'm bowing out here because we are derailing the original thread with a meaningless semantics argument that no one cares about and I'm not particularly interested in chasing you around in circles while you futiley try to prove me wrong. If you find a legit source that supports your original statement, start a new thread. I might stop by. I might not.

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                          #13
                          Re: Connections with Goddesses, but no Gods.......

                          Originally posted by GrantGirl23 View Post
                          so, i have no patron God. this bothers me, because i feel like that should make my practices off-balance.....however, it doesn't seem to.
                          Personally, I believe balance runs deeper than just a god and goddess pair, I think that alone doesn't necessarily mean there's balance in a path. Like you, my path is also focused on a few Greek goddesses, but at this point in time there aren't really any gods in my practice. Even so, it still feels balanced to me, and perhaps more importantly, it's what's working and what makes sense to me. If someone else wants to think I'm unbalanced, oh well, they don't have to do what I'm doing. If it doesn't feel unbalanced to you, and you don't really feel that something is missing, then don't worry about it. Don't think you need to force a connection with a god, if it happens then it happens, and if not there's nothing wrong with that.

                          Now, as to whether you should call yourself a Wiccan or not, that's one of those debates that's been going on for a very long time... There are some who would say that you must worship a god and goddess as it's core to Wicca, and there are others that would disagree (and that's the case for basically every aspect of Wicca). In the end you'll have to decide for yourself if you think your practice is still close enough to Wicca or not, if you're still following along with the other practices of Wicca, etc, or if just calling yourself a witch, pagan, or something else would make more sense for you.
                          Hearth and Hedge

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                            #14
                            Re: Connections with Goddesses, but no Gods.......

                            Originally posted by Gardenia View Post
                            Personally, I believe balance runs deeper than just a god and goddess pair, I think that alone doesn't necessarily mean there's balance in a path. Like you, my path is also focused on a few Greek goddesses, but at this point in time there aren't really any gods in my practice. Even so, it still feels balanced to me, and perhaps more importantly, it's what's working and what makes sense to me. If someone else wants to think I'm unbalanced, oh well, they don't have to do what I'm doing. If it doesn't feel unbalanced to you, and you don't really feel that something is missing, then don't worry about it. Don't think you need to force a connection with a god, if it happens then it happens, and if not there's nothing wrong with that.

                            Now, as to whether you should call yourself a Wiccan or not, that's one of those debates that's been going on for a very long time... There are some who would say that you must worship a god and goddess as it's core to Wicca, and there are others that would disagree (and that's the case for basically every aspect of Wicca). In the end you'll have to decide for yourself if you think your practice is still close enough to Wicca or not, if you're still following along with the other practices of Wicca, etc, or if just calling yourself a witch, pagan, or something else would make more sense for you.
                            thank you, that makes a lot of sense to me. i actually did some more research, and found that i do not really fit into traditional Wicca......however, i do fit into being either just a witch, or a Pagan. i feel that paganism suits me best! thank you for helping me figure that out!

                            and that you all for helping me as well!

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                              #15
                              Re: Connections with Goddesses, but no Gods.......

                              Hello B!

                              Just like everyone here, I have an opinion that may shed some light. First of all: some don't believe in having patron and matron's. If you don't have a patron, that is ok!
                              Second of all: you may have a lot of masculine energy (don't freak out that isn't a bad thing!) OR you may just relate with women more. For example, I used to not work with ANY goddesses. I have a bad history with getting along with mortal women, so I was sure the goddesses were going to be much worse. Because of that, I stuck with the gods. About a year ago, a goddess (Hera) actually approached me. This was a huge surprise because I was expecting her to be the worst. Since then, I have been focusing more on the goddesses with some god influence. So, its ok! Your energy may just be like that!
                              Third:Like most have said, if a god really wants you, they will let you know. Also, sometimes you may have to reach out first. Take it slow When it comes down to it, it is what makes you comfortable.

                              Sorry I am a year to late but...wanted to chime in anyway xD

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