Ancestors (and other beloved dead): Who, why, how?

[Little Star]

Exactly what it says on the tin. If your practice involves ancestors in some way,

1. Who are they?
People you knew personally who have died?
Blood relatives you've never met, found through genealogical records, family stories, etc.?
People not related to you who are important in your tradition (ex: Catholic saints)
People not related to you or your religion who you feel some connection with?

2. Why do you honor them?
Is it required or heavily recommended by your tradition, or a personal preference?
What purpose does honoring ancestors serve?

3. How do you honor them?
Formal rituals?
Prayers?
Doing something in honor of them or to continue their legacy?
Something else?

I've been trying to connect more with my ancestors lately, so I've been thinking about this a lot. I'll post my answers later on.

[thalassa]

Re: Ancestors (and other beloved dead): Who, why, how?

On Memorial Day, we hold a ritual dumb supper for our friends and loved ones, as well as those we didn't know, that have been killed or died as a result of service to their nation.

We set the table in the manner of the Missing Man table, often used in POW/MIA tables---white table cloth, black napkin, a single red rose in a vase tied with a red ribbon, a slice of lemon, and salt sprinkled on the plate, with the glass overturned and the chair tipped in. Not part of the military tradition, we put a sprig of rosemary on everyone's plate, because rosemary is for remembrance.

Before we sit for the meal (generally whatever veggies are at the market with rosemary and lemon pepper roasted potatoes, and usually salmon baked or poached with rosemary and orange--salmon is almost always what we eat for ritual dinners, for its symbolism), we turn out the lights and light the candles while playing Sgt MacKenzie* (it would be better if I knew someone that could bagpipe), have an ad lib prayer and invocation, food (the dumb supper part), a round of toasting**, give thanks to those that shared our table with an alternate verse to the Navy Hymn***, and read a poem by Archibald MacLeisch****, and play Going Home and then Taps.

*Sgt Mackenzie:

**In its current incarnation, the round of toasting speech goes pretty much like this:

countless and often unknown women that have served their country from its conception and died in combat, despite prohibitions against such service.
(Hail the honored dead!)


Let us remember those that have served their country to protect rights they could only hope that they could one day claim as well, from the Colored Troops of the Civil War to the gay and lesbian troops still fighting for equal protection of the law and equal recognition of their families.
(Hail the honored dead!)


Let us remember those of the Pagan community that have given their life in service to their country

The young dead soldiers do not speak.
Nevertheless they are heard in the still houses:
who has not heard them?
They have a silence that speaks for them
at night and when the clock counts. They say, We were young.
We have died. Remember us.

They say, We have done what we could
but until it is finished it is not done.
They say, We have given our lives
but until it is finished no one can know what our lives gave.

They say, Our deaths are not ours:
they are yours: they will mean what you make them.
They say, Whether our lives and our deaths were for peace and a new hope
or for nothing we cannot say: it is you who must say this.

They say, We leave you our deaths:
give them their meaning: give them an end to the war
and a true peace: give them a victory that ends the war
and a peace afterwards: give them their meaning.

We were young, they say. We have died. Remember us.

[Hawkfeathers]

Re: Ancestors (and other beloved dead): Who, why, how?

^^^That's really cool, Thal. Reminds me (just due to setting a place for someone who isn't there) of setting a place for Elijah at the Passover Seder meal.

[anubisa]

Re: Ancestors (and other beloved dead): Who, why, how?

[QUOTE=Little Star;174035]Exactly what it says on the tin. If your practice involves ancestors in some way,

1. Who are they?

My Grandpa (on my dad's side). I was really close to him and miss him the most.

2. Why do you honor them?

I honor my Grandpa because I love him and want to keep connected to him.

3. How do you honor them?

I have a picture of my Grandpa on my altar and I talk to him every night before I go to bed. On Samhain I try to do a ritual to connect more with him.

[Rae'ya]

Re: Ancestors (and other beloved dead): Who, why, how?

I am... err... not as dedicated as I should be to ancestor work. It's on my list of things that fall within my 'get my household together' but has taken a backseat to more pressing life things at the moment. So I'm getting there... but I don't really have an active ancestor practice yet... just a background half-practice that will evolve at some point. So with that in mind...

1. Who are they?
People you knew personally who have died?
Blood relatives you've never met, found through genealogical records, family stories, etc.?
People not related to you who are important in your tradition (ex: Catholic saints)
People not related to you or your religion who you feel some connection with?

So far it's a less personal, generalised 'people who contributed to my genetic line' sort of thing. I don't have specific names and faces, as I haven't attempted to make connections with active Ancestor spirits yet. Torey has done some of my genealogical tree, so I do have some historical names that I count amongst my ancestors. But at the moment there's nothing more specific than 'I'm descended from so and so, I'll research their life and stories'.

There are recent blood relatives who've died, but I don't feel that any of them are particularly interested in being active Ancestor spirits. I don't really have any non-blood relative individuals that I honor, but I do nod my hat to my cultural ancestors in a very broad sense.

2. Why do you honor them?
Is it required or heavily recommended by your tradition, or a personal preference?
What purpose does honoring ancestors serve?

I think that ancestors are a group of spirits that are often undervalued in paganism. Ancestor veneration is important to the Northern faiths... but for a reason, not just 'because'. I'm not interested in ancestor work just because it's recommended, but because I do actually value the contribution that they have had, and may have, to my orlog. I am who I am today because of those who have come before me. Yes, much of it is ME and my personality and the events that have shaped my life thus far, but there is a background undercurrent to that... my Thread was spun from the recycled Threads of my ancestors, and that is significant.

3. How do you honor them?
Formal rituals?
Prayers?
Doing something in honor of them or to continue their legacy?
Something else?

At the moment, nothing physical. I have an altar planned, which is basically on hold until our house is built later in the year. We are very bad at observing sacred dates of any sort (I have a hard enough time with birthdays and anniversaries!) so we don't do any of the classic dumb suppers or Samhain place settings. However, I keep ancestor work in the back of my mind, and on my to-do list, and that's as best as I can manage right at the moment.

[Thorbjorn]

Re: Ancestors (and other beloved dead): Who, why, how?

I have what might be a bit of an odd view of ancestors.

1. Who are they?
People you knew personally who have died?
Blood relatives you've never met, found through genealogical records, family stories, etc.?
People not related to you who are important in your tradition (ex: Catholic saints)
People not related to you or your religion who you feel some connection with?

Though I have a small picture of my deceased parents on my altar, I do not have a close feeling for them. Our relationship was rocky to say the least. To that end, their picture comes and goes depending on my level of feeling guilty for not honoring them as I "should". My 4 siblings range from 12 - 19 years older than me, so I was raised pretty much as an only child. I didn't know my maternal grandparents all that well, though my grandmother was quite affectionate. My grandfather was more than a little distant. I did not know my paternal grandparents at all, since they died before I was born. I consider all the unknown people of centuries past as my ancestors, whatever their ethnicity was. It's up for grabs... I should know in about 10 weeks with the results of my personal DNA test. I think of them as true ancestors, whomever they were. As I said, that may seem odd.

2. Why do you honor them?
Is it required or heavily recommended by your tradition, or a personal preference?
What purpose does honoring ancestors serve?

3. How do you honor them?
Formal rituals?
Prayers?
Doing something in honor of them or to continue their legacy?
Something else?

I include a praise and hail to ancestors in my regular toasts, and have some prayers honoring them. I also have a small decorative tree on my altar representing my family tree., and alternately, Yggdrasil. Beyond that, I don't have anything. I might start doing something on All Souls' Day. There are other "Days of Remembrance", just a few are:

March 28 - Ragnar Lodbrok's day, the sack of Paris.

October 9 - Leif Eriksson Day .

October 28 - Remembrance for Erik the Red.

I suppose one could make a special toast or offering. I haven't done that but I may.

- - - Updated - - -

I am... err... not as dedicated as I should be to ancestor work. It's on my list of things that fall within my 'get my household together' but has taken a backseat to more pressing life things at the moment. So I'm getting there... but I don't really have an active ancestor practice yet... just a background half-practice that will evolve at some point. So with that in mind...



So far it's a less personal, generalised 'people who contributed to my genetic line' sort of thing. I don't have specific names and faces, as I haven't attempted to make connections with active Ancestor spirits yet. Torey has done some of my genealogical tree, so I do have some historical names that I count amongst my ancestors. But at the moment there's nothing more specific than 'I'm descended from so and so, I'll research their life and stories'.

There are recent blood relatives who've died, but I don't feel that any of them are particularly interested in being active Ancestor spirits. I don't really have any non-blood relative individuals that I honor, but I do nod my hat to my cultural ancestors in a very broad sense.



I think that ancestors are a group of spirits that are often undervalued in paganism. Ancestor veneration is important to the Northern faiths... but for a reason, not just 'because'. I'm not interested in ancestor work just because it's recommended, but because I do actually value the contribution that they have had, and may have, to my orlog. I am who I am today because of those who have come before me. Yes, much of it is ME and my personality and the events that have shaped my life thus far, but there is a background undercurrent to that... my Thread was spun from the recycled Threads of my ancestors, and that is significant.



At the moment, nothing physical. I have an altar planned, which is basically on hold until our house is built later in the year. We are very bad at observing sacred dates of any sort (I have a hard enough time with birthdays and anniversaries!) so we don't do any of the classic dumb suppers or Samhain place settings. However, I keep ancestor work in the back of my mind, and on my to-do list, and that's as best as I can manage right at the moment.

I should have just plagiarized you... I virtually wrote the same thing you did.

[Little Star]

Re: Ancestors (and other beloved dead): Who, why, how?

I consider all the unknown people of centuries past as my ancestors, whatever their ethnicity was. It's up for grabs... I should know in about 10 weeks with the results of my personal DNA test. I think of them as true ancestors, whomever they were. As I said, that may seem odd.

No, I don't think that's odd at all. Honestly, it's really cool that we live in a time where we're able to trace ancestry back like that. I think it in a way democratizes the experience of having that sense of continuity and connection across centuries that used to only be available to people socially important enough to have their ancestry documented.

A couple sides of my family were aristocratic and do have this very far-reaching documentation, and I would be lying if I said I didn't get a sense of enjoyment out of that. Even though they're not people at all close to me, knowing that they existed gives me I guess a sense of having roots, of being from somewhere.

[Thorbjorn]

Re: Ancestors (and other beloved dead): Who, why, how?

No, I don't think that's odd at all. Honestly, it's really cool that we live in a time where we're able to trace ancestry back like that. I think it in a way democratizes the experience of having that sense of continuity and connection across centuries that used to only be available to people socially important enough to have their ancestry documented.

A couple sides of my family were aristocratic and do have this very far-reaching documentation, and I would be lying if I said I didn't get a sense of enjoyment out of that. Even though they're not people at all close to me, knowing that they existed gives me I guess a sense of having roots, of being from somewhere.

Those are good points. We've tried tracing our family tree but we can't get further back than my grandparents. They came from small villages in Sicily and southern Italy. Chances are that when the village priest died or the town got flooded records were lost.

Conversely, I had a co-worker who was very much into genealogy. She traveled around and gathered as much as she could. It turns out she was able to trace her family back to Gen. George Armstrong Custer. Then it was an easy enough task to trace backwards from him, being as historically well-known (notorious?) as he is. Iirc she said the name was originally Kuster, of German(ic) descent.

I agree that with modern technology in genetics it really is cool to find out who we are and where we come from. See, I'm not happy just knowing we are of Sicilian descent. I mean, who were the Sicilians? They're an admixture of everyone from Scandinavia to the Near East. Because we have no way of tracing our family tree via paper, at least I can know where my ancestors came from based on my Y-haplogroup. Then I can make up stories.