Questions about Islam (Ask Away!)

[anunitu]

Re: Questions about Islam (Ask Away!)

I always wondered about the Sufi,and how they fit into the belief system.

[GabrielWithoutWings]

Re: Questions about Islam (Ask Away!)

A virtuous Pagan was a person, though they had Pagan beliefs, were still considered to be an asset to theology or even favored by God, before the coming of Christianity or Islam.

For example, if you read Inferno by Dante, he meets up with Virgil, who is described as a virtuous Pagan.

Usually to mean philosophers who helped formulate arguments for the existence of One God, as opposed to several polytheistic deities, eg, Aristotle's Unmoved Prime Mover and that sort of thing.

[Medusa]

Re: Questions about Islam (Ask Away!)

Gabe, you probably aren't going to like the answer. Though Dumuzi is a great and nice guy. He's a Fundamentalist. And there will be no iffies in his beliefs.

[Dumuzi]

Re: Questions about Islam (Ask Away!)

A virtuous Pagan was a person, though they had Pagan beliefs, were still considered to be an asset to theology or even favored by God, before the coming of Christianity or Islam.

For example, if you read Inferno by Dante, he meets up with Virgil, who is described as a virtuous Pagan.

Usually to mean philosophers who helped formulate arguments for the existence of One God, as opposed to several polytheistic deities, eg, Aristotle's Unmoved Prime Mover and that sort of thing.

Oh now I understand what you mean. You are asking about people who didn't hear about the message and how they'd be judged, correct?

Hmm it's kinda complicated so I gotta mention a few things first. First I gotta clear up a misconception. We don't believe Islam is a religion that started with Muhammad. It's the religion of all messengers and prophets all the way back to Adam. The Qur'an also states that to all nations a messenger was sent.

We also believe that all human beings were born with a fitra. Which is the natural state that we are born with, that makes us inclined to be good. In other words, we are all born Muslim in the general sense.

To answer your question directly, we believe that god is just. So if someone never heard about the message then they will be judged according to their actions and the intentions of their heart. In short, the only one that can judge them is the one that knows what's in their hearts.

Well, I wasn't asking about being Muslim. I was asking if Muslims (or, just you) believe Allah will show mercy to those that, while not being Muslim, still believe in one God, eg, Jews, Baha'is, Christians, Hanif, Zoroastrians, etc. Monism isn't necessarily Pantheism. Pantheism equates God with the Universe. Monism means that Creation issues forth from God like waves issue from a stone dropped in a pool of water, as opposed to one moment in Creation where there was nothing and then God creates ex nihilo.

Allah shows mercy to who he wants. It is considered arrogant to speak for god in regards to that subject. At the same time it's very important to point out that in terms of religion, the Qur'an is very clear that the only way of life accepted by god is Islam.

So if someone wants the mercy of Allah, they have to seek it first. Someone might claim to believe in god, but what good does believing do, if someone wants to go against god? The best example I can think of is that of Satan. Satan is also a believer of god, and a monotheist. Does that automatically make him someone that will enter heaven?

Like I mentioned before in this thread, you cannot reject god's mercy and then complain when you don't get it at the same time. One has to seek it first.

[Medusa]

Re: Questions about Islam (Ask Away!)

Fitra. What if I am in my fitra and it's my state to be just the way I am..an Atheist. Then what?

[Dumuzi]

Re: Questions about Islam (Ask Away!)

Fitra. What if I am in my fitra and it's my state to be just the way I am..an Atheist. Then what?

I know that's what you believe. But Muslims believe that god created us with that inborn natural predisposition. However, in the general sense, it's not just about submitting to god but also to do good in general. So in reality you do lots of things in accordance to your Fitra. You follow lots of the rules of god, even though you don't even believe in him. That's because you are following that part of your nature.

You were raised Catholic, think of it as the Original Sin, only the opposite

So direct your face toward the religion, inclining to truth. [Adhere to] the fitrah of Allah upon which He has created [all] people. No change should there be in the creation of Allah . That is the correct religion, but most of the people do not know. [30:30]

[habbalah]

Re: Questions about Islam (Ask Away!)

Now that's it been brought up, can you explain what fitra is?

[GabrielWithoutWings]

Re: Questions about Islam (Ask Away!)

Gabe, you probably aren't going to like the answer. Though Dumuzi is a great and nice guy. He's a Fundamentalist. And there will be no iffies in his beliefs.

Not a problem. I investigated Islam about six years ago and respect it greatly, even if I disagree with a lot of what it says.

I would expect no less.

[Dumuzi]

Re: Questions about Islam (Ask Away!)

Now that's it been brought up, can you explain what fitra is?

Sure. Like I said before, Fitrah is our natural disposition that we are born with. In Islam we believe all human beings are born Muslim, but it's their parents/society that raise them up to follow other religions. So when someone becomes a Muslim after they grow up, they are really just returning to their original state or nature.

[habbalah]

Re: Questions about Islam (Ask Away!)

Sure. Like I said before, Fitrah is our natural disposition that we are born with. In Islam we believe all human beings are born Muslim, but it's their parents/society that raise them up to follow other religions. So when someone becomes a Muslim after they grow up, they are really just returning to their original state or nature.

What about the people who never hear the teachings of Islam? Either because the religion hasn't spread to their part of the world, or they simply never have the opportunity to learn about it before they die. Whatever the reason.

[Dumuzi]

Re: Questions about Islam (Ask Away!)

What about the people who never hear the teachings of Islam? Either because the religion hasn't spread to their part of the world, or they simply never have the opportunity to learn about it before they die. Whatever the reason.

What about them? Are you asking how they are judged?

[anunitu]

Re: Questions about Islam (Ask Away!)

Though I asked this before,it was such a short post,you might have missed my question..What I asked was how the Sufi fit into the nature and overall structure of Islam?

[Dumuzi]

Re: Questions about Islam (Ask Away!)

Though I asked this before,it was such a short post,you might have missed my question..What I asked was how the Sufi fit into the nature and overall structure of Islam?

ooops, sorry!

Sufi isn't really a different sect of Islam. In terms of beliefs we all believe in the same things, with the exception of a few groups here and there. Just like there are different schools of thought in regards to the sciences of laws and rules in Islam, Sufi or Tasawwuf is about the science of good manners. That is they concern themselves on how to live in order to grow closer to god. Often, they try to move away from pleasures of this world, so they can dedicate themselves completely to god.

In my opinion, it's more of an extreme spiritual way to look at religion.

[anunitu]

Re: Questions about Islam (Ask Away!)

Thanks for the explanation,I had no real understanding about this before.

[Raphaeline]

Re: Questions about Islam (Ask Away!)

I went to service today at the local masjed to observe. I have two questions:

The imam gave a speech entirely in Arabic, and then repeated it (I think, because obviously I didn't understand the first half, but that's the impression I got), but the second half contained probably around 40% Arabic, too (usually involving quotes from the Qu'ran). Is speaking at least SOME Arabic considered obligatory?

Secondly, my friend and I were the only females in the building with the exception of about six young girls and five other women, but there were about a hundred men there. Did we happen to come on a day with some special significance for men? I wondered if maybe there was a separate service for the women because the five praying women stayed not just in the back of the room but instead were in a hallway off to the side (facing the glowing EXIT sign in the dark, which seemed awfully lonely compared to the grand open room the men were in... I was surprised that they chose to be so separate)...
Why might there be so few women present?