I am currently serving in the US Navy (for those of you who haven't seen my intro thread yet) and with paganism growing more prevalent in my life almost daily, I am seeing myself faced with a number of questions first and foremost of which being: If I am out here in the ocean surrounded by steel, what am I to do about delving deeper into any one of a number of paths that all seem to demand that I immerse myself in secrecy, solitude, and nature? I am having an increasingly difficult time achieving the concentration necessary for meditation or energy channeling. And to top it off, there is only one known pagan on board that I am aware of without publicly proclaiming my interests in paganism amidst a primary Christian crew and he is only experienced in coven based Wicca. I find myself slightly discouraged with nearly every avenue of my pursuit in finding truth within Paganism leading me to a dead end. Are there any words of wisdom for a weary soul lost at sea? Any and all input is welcome.
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Paganism at sea...
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Re: Paganism at sea...
Why not look into the various sea gods/goddesses? I know you guys share spaces so an altar is out. Can you get some guided meditations for like an ipod?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_deityLast edited by Ula; 31 Jul 2012, 16:28.
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sea witch
- Oct 2005
- 11651
- relational theophysis and bioregional witchery
- coastal Georgia
- *a little bad taste is like a nice dash of paprika*
Re: Paganism at sea...
I was in the Navy for 6 years and openly Pagan, as was my hubby, and a good number of most of our friends. Honestly, I had far more problems with being in the military in the Pagan community than I ever had being openly Pagan in the Navy. It was my experience that Paganism was an excuse to give shitty sailors a hard time, rather than something any of my chains of command or coworkers cared about.
Anyhoo...first, I'd have to ask what sort of command you are on? Surface or sub? Big crew or small? (You don't need to bust out your ship name or anything, but a big deck or a carrier makes it pretty easy compared to a small boy). And what is your rate? As a corpsman, I could always find a spot where no one would bother me, but as a deck seaman, I had a little bit of a harder time. Another thing to consider, depending on where you are homeported, there may be an active Pagan community...deployments aren't forever. Here in Norfolk there is a regular open drumcircle on Monday nights, and a number of smaller drumcircles and groups that do rituals as well as other path-specific groups, you just have to look around for them.
As for spirituality at sea... I've never had a practice that demanded secrecy or solitude, and Nature is just a couple of inches of steel away. I worship aquatic deities almost exclusively. And, the best place to meditate for me was the shower, or in my rack before bed. The hubby's ship actually had an "Earth Based Spirituality" Group, which was sponsored by the Catholic chaplain and led by him and two E-6's that were Pagan as well. On my destroyer, I even knew of a dozen Pagans, and in my department on shore duty, 6 out of 25 of us were Pagan. I'm willing to bet there are more than just the two of you...Wonderful Life: The Burgess Shale and the Nature of HistoryPagan Devotionals, because the wind and the rain is our Bible
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Re: Paganism at sea...
Well, we have a protestant specific chaplain embarked. I have spoken with him at length numerous times and he only seems to cater to the christian I used to be and how he can rekindle that flame. He has made it apparent that he has no experience with pagans and would prefer not to either. If there are any pagans on board they probably won't be jumping at the opportunity to fellowship since the fellow I mentioned earlier has done well to shout it from the rooftops that he is a witch and practices magic. Needless to say his poor delivery has led more than a few to speak out openly about their opinions of such beliefs, all negative of course.
With that I am not entirely interested in forming a group to meet with. Instead I simply wish to flesh out whatever it is I believe and branch out from there, but I'm finding it difficult to do so. I don't necessarily believe in any "Gods" or deities so looking to the sea itself doesn't seem like a viable option. I don't have the option to download anything for my ipod and as an operations specialist (within a predominantly christian division I might add) I don't have any secluded spaces to take up shelter in. I'm stationed on an LSD out of VA beach so we have a pretty sizable crew, but I have been on board for about 5 years now and haven't seen many pagans pass through. I am really just looking to discover what it is all of this means to me but I don't want to put it off now when I am feeling so strongly about it.
My father died in March at the beginning of this deployment and the event brought the concept of my mortality and his journey through a proposed afterlife to the front of my mind. I know I don't believe in Christ or "Heaven" as detailed in the Bible, but I can't deny that there has to be some place that our energies go when our body dies and can no longer contain them. I don't know if this will lead me toward Pantheism, Shintoism, Zen, or what but I know I can't ignore it. I hope I'm at least making a little bit of sense because I feel like I'm rambling.
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sea witch
- Oct 2005
- 11651
- relational theophysis and bioregional witchery
- coastal Georgia
- *a little bad taste is like a nice dash of paprika*
Re: Paganism at sea...
Originally posted by theAmbassador View PostWell, we have a protestant specific chaplain embarked. I have spoken with him at length numerous times and he only seems to cater to the christian I used to be and how he can rekindle that flame. He has made it apparent that he has no experience with pagans and would prefer not to either.
If there are any pagans on board they probably won't be jumping at the opportunity to fellowship since the fellow I mentioned earlier has done well to shout it from the rooftops that he is a witch and practices magic. Needless to say his poor delivery has led more than a few to speak out openly about their opinions of such beliefs, all negative of course.
I'm not saying its something that works for everyone. I'm just saying that it can be done (and done in such a way that sort of tones down the opinion that all Pagans are like *them*. Also, I can see, if you are newly exploring Paganism, that it might not be your thing. By the time I joined the Navy, I'd been Pagan for 10 years, so I was used to it, lol!
With that I am not entirely interested in forming a group to meet with. Instead I simply wish to flesh out whatever it is I believe and branch out from there, but I'm finding it difficult to do so.
I don't necessarily believe in any "Gods" or deities so looking to the sea itself doesn't seem like a viable option.
I don't have the option to download anything for my ipod and as an operations specialist (within a predominantly christian division I might add) I don't have any secluded spaces to take up shelter in. I'm stationed on an LSD out of VA beach so we have a pretty sizable crew, but I have been on board for about 5 years now and haven't seen many pagans pass through. I am really just looking to discover what it is all of this means to me but I don't want to put it off now when I am feeling so strongly about it.
I'm not sure what your rack arrangement is, or how tall you might be, but as a short person in a top rack, I could use the top of my rack as a desk, since the opening was between frames. I could also lay on my stomach in my rack and write, or on my back and type on my laptop. Another option, though, might be somewhere like the ship's library or classroom (ours had those little desks with the sides on them, and hours for people that wanted to chill)? Or even the mess decks afterhours when everyone else is playing cards and stuff--of course, that depends on your watch schedule and all that. Its too bad your chaplain isn't helpful, our Catholic chaplain would open the chapel for people that wanted "contemplative time" as he called it.
And reading/research isn't that difficult to do with the time you have online...I don't know how much research you've done (though your wife is Wiccan? So I assume you know at least a bit about Wicca), but reading about other paths and traditions and mythology and modes of thought, etc is always a good place to start. If you are interested in anything in particular, we have a pretty diverse crowd here that could probably offer you a good book/website list. I'm not sure how much DoD and IT approved websites have changed in the last few years, but the last time I was on a ship, I could order books on amazon and have them delivered to my family and have them mail them to me (though you might be able to ship them directly to an APO address, I never bothered to see)--if you buy used books off amazon, you can often get them (plus the 3.99 shipping) cheaper that their normal price. Another option might be to read online--you can buy kindle books and use their cloud reader over the web.
You can also practice meditation--in your rack (great way to clear your mind before you go to sleep) or in the shower (good "cleansing" visualization) or if your ship has a handy out of the way spot on the outer decks where you can catch a few minutes of zen--the aft missile deck was my spot...especially in the evening, right before darken ship. Also, you don't have to believe in deities to see Nature in the Sea and Sky...if you are like my hubby, and more of a woods and mountains type, it can be a bit more of a challenge, that's all...
My father died in March at the beginning of this deployment and the event brought the concept of my mortality and his journey through a proposed afterlife to the front of my mind. I know I don't believe in Christ or "Heaven" as detailed in the Bible, but I can't deny that there has to be some place that our energies go when our body dies and can no longer contain them. I don't know if this will lead me toward Pantheism, Shintoism, Zen, or what but I know I can't ignore it. I hope I'm at least making a little bit of sense because I feel like I'm rambling.
...and I do think you've made excellent sense.Wonderful Life: The Burgess Shale and the Nature of HistoryPagan Devotionals, because the wind and the rain is our Bible
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Re: Paganism at sea...
Before I met my wife, I'd only ever encountered two pagans before her, both Wiccan, and neither of which I knew were pagan until after I decided to learn about it for myself. Being from a fundamentalist Christian background for so many years and of my own choosing, even after having left the church entirely I was still slightly apprehensive and off put by her religion. Until that point I had been taught that pagans were a number of things, but normal was not one of them. It took some time, but curiosity and a gradually opening mind led me to start researching Wicca. I was astounded by what I found in the pages of several books by several different Wiccan authors (most of which are solitary practitioners). I had no idea that I would agree with so much of what I found within those pages.
Since then I have been seeking out anything and everything I deemed a relevant and reliable resource on paganism in general. I have expressed to my wife that I have a vested interest in pursuing Wicca, but that if I do it will be for me and not because she is Wiccan. She comes from a family environment where numerous religious paths were taken and everyone in her household was respectful of each others beliefs. I know that no matter where I find myself spiritually she will respect my decision and that makes my journey a lot easier. She has sent some of my Wiccan/Pagan books in the mail for me. I just hope they get here before the end of deployment lol.
As for being underway, I'm on a class of ship that has no chapel and few recreational facilities unless you fancy going to one of our 6 gyms everyday. We use our only rec room for church services and our library is a lover's cove and remains constantly packed. For how large my platform is, there isn't much in the way of space. I will try my best to find some place that I can get alone time. My berthing isn't completely practical for meditation or quiet time, but it is something in the event that I can't find something more suitable.
My struggle lately is with the actually act of meditation. I find it exceedingly difficult to clear my mind enough to focus on what my body is trying to tell me. I try just visualizing myself in a forest (as I am a forest and mountains kind of guy) but I can't seem to hold onto the visual long enough before all of the background noise in my mind sets in. I just have way too much shuffling around in my mind.
At this moment with everything that I have taken in, I really feel like I am just looking to a foundation in nature and some sense of my place in the universe itself. I agree with a lot of what science has to teach us but I would also say that most scientists don't pretend to have all of the answers. The truth behind the energy that gives us life and thought and emotion is beyond the grasp of science, but it's existence cannot be denied. We simply cannot deny self. With that, I look around me and see the earth and beyond it the universe. So much of it connects for me creating this sort of cyclical existence. None of this was apparent to me as a Christian having been taught that all that we see before us is simply a throw away compared to what waits for us in Heaven. I can't help but feel that the same energy that flourishes in me and everyone else crosses paths with the energy of the other living things on Earth. With that I can start to conceptualize that the Earth itself which we can see permeates raw energy might also have life in it as well. Magnetic monopoles and electrical impulses are just a pair of examples.
Given all of that, I can say that my beliefs may rest with Pantheism and Shamanism. I'm just not sure though. There really are so many paths one can walk. Am I making any sense? All of this is derived simply from my understanding of how all of this comes together with everything that I have learned since I began this study. However, even as I begin to forge a foundation for my beliefs, I am still lost on how to act on them while away from all of the resources one would have at home.
All of this makes more sense when on the screen as opposed to rattling around in my mind.Last edited by theAmbassador; 01 Aug 2012, 09:47.
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sea witch
- Oct 2005
- 11651
- relational theophysis and bioregional witchery
- coastal Georgia
- *a little bad taste is like a nice dash of paprika*
Re: Paganism at sea...
Originally posted by theAmbassador View PostBefore I met my wife, I'd only ever encountered two pagans before her, both Wiccan, and neither of which I knew were pagan until after I decided to learn about it for myself. Being from a fundamentalist Christian background for so many years and of my own choosing, even after having left the church entirely I was still slightly apprehensive and off put by her religion. Until that point I had been taught that pagans were a number of things, but normal was not one of them. It took some time, but curiosity and a gradually opening mind led me to start researching Wicca. I was astounded by what I found in the pages of several books by several different Wiccan authors (most of which are solitary practitioners). I had no idea that I would agree with so much of what I found within those pages.
Since then I have been seeking out anything and everything I deemed a relevant and reliable resource on paganism in general. I have expressed to my wife that I have a vested interest in pursuing Wicca, but that if I do it will be for me and not because she is Wiccan. She comes from a family environment where numerous religious paths were taken and everyone in her household was respectful of each others beliefs. I know that no matter where I find myself spiritually she will respect my decision and that makes my journey a lot easier. She has sent some of my Wiccan/Pagan books in the mail for me. I just hope they get here before the end of deployment lol.
As for being underway, I'm on a class of ship that has no chapel and few recreational facilities unless you fancy going to one of our 6 gyms everyday. We use our only rec room for church services and our library is a lover's cove and remains constantly packed. For how large my platform is, there isn't much in the way of space. I will try my best to find some place that I can get alone time. My berthing isn't completely practical for meditation or quiet time, but it is something in the event that I can't find something more suitable.
My struggle lately is with the actually act of meditation. I find it exceedingly difficult to clear my mind enough to focus on what my body is trying to tell me. I try just visualizing myself in a forest (as I am a forest and mountains kind of guy) but I can't seem to hold onto the visual long enough before all of the background noise in my mind sets in. I just have way too much shuffling around in my mind.
At this moment with everything that I have taken in, I really feel like I am just looking to a foundation in nature and some sense of my place in the universe itself. I agree with a lot of what science has to teach us but I would also say that most scientists don't pretend to have all of the answers. The truth behind the energy that gives us life and thought and emotion is beyond the grasp of science, but it's existence cannot be denied. We simply cannot deny self. With that, I look around me and see the earth and beyond it the universe. So much of it connects for me creating this sort of cyclical existence. None of this was apparent to me as a Christian having been taught that all that we see before us is simply a throw away compared to what waits for us in Heaven. I can't help but feel that the same energy that flourishes in me and everyone else crosses paths with the energy of the other living things on Earth. With that I can start to conceptualize that the Earth itself which we can see permeates raw energy might also have life in it as well. Magnetic monopoles and electrical impulses are just a pair of examples.
Given all of that, I can say that my beliefs may rest with Pantheism and Shamanism. I'm just not sure though. There really are so many paths one can walk. Am I making any sense? All of this is derived simply from my understanding of how all of this comes together with everything that I have learned since I began this study. However, even as I begin to forge a foundation for my beliefs, I am still lost on how to act on them while away from all of the resources one would have at home.
All of this makes more sense when on the screen as opposed to rattling around in my mind.Wonderful Life: The Burgess Shale and the Nature of HistoryPagan Devotionals, because the wind and the rain is our Bible
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Re: Paganism at sea...
Could you refer me to said practitioners of shamanism? I have a few questions I'd like to ask and I feel like starting a new thread over it would only unnecessarily clutter the forum. Thoughts?Last edited by theAmbassador; 02 Aug 2012, 01:58.
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sea witch
- Oct 2005
- 11651
- relational theophysis and bioregional witchery
- coastal Georgia
- *a little bad taste is like a nice dash of paprika*
Re: Paganism at sea...
Originally posted by theAmbassador View PostCould you refer me to said practitioners of shamanism? I have a few questions I'd like to ask and I feel like starting a new thread over it would only unnecessarily clutter the forum. Thoughts?Wonderful Life: The Burgess Shale and the Nature of HistoryPagan Devotionals, because the wind and the rain is our Bible
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Re: Paganism at sea...
Thank you!
Also, As a vet you must have been deployed while your spouse was at home so maybe you can help me with this:
My wife is at home taking care of our two small boys and tells me she doesn't really have the energy to converse about religion. I am a little discouraged by this because I feel like this is a critical time for me while I essentially rediscovering myself. I try to remind myself that she really is busy and as I know raising two boys is draining, but I want to be able to communicate to her how serious and exciting this is to me without coming off as inconsiderate or uncaring of the work she is doing at home while I am away.
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sea witch
- Oct 2005
- 11651
- relational theophysis and bioregional witchery
- coastal Georgia
- *a little bad taste is like a nice dash of paprika*
Re: Paganism at sea...
Originally posted by theAmbassador View PostThank you!
Also, As a vet you must have been deployed while your spouse was at home so maybe you can help me with this:
My wife is at home taking care of our two small boys and tells me she doesn't really have the energy to converse about religion. I am a little discouraged by this because I feel like this is a critical time for me while I essentially rediscovering myself. I try to remind myself that she really is busy and as I know raising two boys is draining, but I want to be able to communicate to her how serious and exciting this is to me without coming off as inconsiderate or uncaring of the work she is doing at home while I am away.
That really didn't answer your question...I have to run an errand, and don't really have time to answer it properly...I'll get back to it shortly! Well, at least by this evening, I think...Wonderful Life: The Burgess Shale and the Nature of HistoryPagan Devotionals, because the wind and the rain is our Bible
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Re: Paganism at sea...
Originally posted by thalassa View PostWe were both active duty, so we both know what its like to be in both positions...which made it a bit easier us to "get" where each other were coming from. The hardest part about being the person at home is that there is only so much support when you are living away from family. Is she part of any groups? The hubby and I are in Norfolk and I'm *trying* to organize a family co-op for Pagan families, and we have a women's meet-up group that we are trying to start, and the UU congregation I belong to has a group for military families that provides child care at out meetings. If you want, you can PM me, and I can give you my email to give to her, not sure what age your kids are, but mine are 3 and 5 and *love* play dates--there are quite a few parks and the beach.
That really didn't answer your question...I have to run an errand, and don't really have time to answer it properly...I'll get back to it shortly! Well, at least by this evening, I think...
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sea witch
- Oct 2005
- 11651
- relational theophysis and bioregional witchery
- coastal Georgia
- *a little bad taste is like a nice dash of paprika*
Re: Paganism at sea...
Originally posted by theAmbassador View PostI will await your response patiently then. However, I should add that my children are one and four years old, and I am soon to transfer out of Virginia on new orders so seeking out groups to join doesn't seem practical at this point.
In regards to your previous question, I think you sort of hit the nail on the head with this: "I try to remind myself that she really is busy and as I know raising two boys is draining, but I want to be able to communicate to her how serious and exciting this is to me without coming off as inconsiderate or uncaring of the work she is doing at home while I am away."
Tell ^ to her. Just phrase it a little differently...something like this:
"Hey honey, I know that it is rough to have the boys by yourself and that you are tired and busy and have a lot of things to take care of right now, and talking about this isn't all that high on your priority list right now, but I've seen how comfortable you are with your faith, and with the recent death of my father and the whole deployment time away from you all, I've had a lot of time to think about the whole religion thing, and I'd really appreciate it if you would take the extra time to be a sounding board for some of my ideas on my faith journey because I really trust your insight and judgement on this topic."
followed by something like "I've been thinking about __enter topic__ for a while, and was wondering what your take on it was?" or "I've been thinking about __X__ and have come to the conclusion of __Y__ and wanted to know what you think of that" or something along those lines...
...of course, you might want to make it sound more like you, so she doesn't break out the bullshit flag, lol...
Seriously though, just tell her how you feel---but totally preface it with your understanding of the difficulty of what she is going through, and that while she might not have the time and energy to be *with* you on your path, that you would be appreciative of whatever thought and support she can give. Because I've done a deployment as a deck seaman and as a corpsman, and the hubby has done deployments as a hull technician, and I can tell you that both of us admit being the person at home with the kids and not much support is really worse...Wonderful Life: The Burgess Shale and the Nature of HistoryPagan Devotionals, because the wind and the rain is our Bible
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