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Difference between Archetype and God?

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    #16
    Re: Difference between Archetype and God?

    Yes, I see what you're saying. With regard to Corbin's question, I think the west would mostly claim that man lives in history. But perhaps we need to consider that history lives in us too. It would certainly widen the way we view and interpret the world.

    People often feel that Jung is a bit 'out there' when it comes to reality and non-reality. But I think he had a pretty firm grasp on both. And I also think he was way ahead of his time. During his 1923 Polzeath Seminars, Jung stated that the four aspects of the modern psyche that had suffered most due to (at that time) colonialisation and presumably later it would include globalisation). Bear in mind that Jung was stating this almost 100 years ago and much has happened since then that has exaggerated the process still further. These four areas were: nature, animals, creative fantasy and primal man. And yet these are the very areas that are experiencing the greatest research and of interest nowadays by those seeking some sort of spiritual path.

    Personally I think Jung had a lot of different opinions on this subject throughout his career - he had such a long life and died as recently as 1961!
    www.thewolfenhowlepress.com


    Phantom Turnips never die.... they just get stewed occasionally....

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      #17
      Re: Difference between Archetype and God?

      To randomly steal concepts from programming, archetypes are classes. Everything within a class has specific common traits and does specific things. Gods are objects built from those classes, each god will have the traits of the class it belongs to but those traits not appear identically to other gods of the same class.

      To put things in non-geek speak, all skyfathers are jet fighters but not all of them are F-15s.
      life itself was a lightsaber in his hands; even in the face of treachery and death and hopes gone cold, he burned like a candle in the darkness. Like a star shining in the black eternity of space.

      Yoda: Dark Rendezvous

      "But those men who know anything at all about the Light also know that there is a fierceness to its power, like the bare sword of the law, or the white burning of the sun." Suddenly his voice sounded to Will very strong, and very Welsh. "At the very heart, that is. Other things, like humanity, and mercy, and charity, that most good men hold more precious than all else, they do not come first for the Light. Oh, sometimes they are there; often, indeed. But in the very long run the concern of you people is with the absolute good, ahead of all else..."

      John Rowlands, The Grey King by Susan Cooper

      "You come from the Lord Adam and the Lady Eve", said Aslan. "And that is both honour enough to erect the head of the poorest beggar, and shame enough to bow the shoulders of the greatest emperor on earth; be content."

      Aslan, Prince Caspian by CS Lewis


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        #18
        Re: Difference between Archetype and God?

        Originally posted by Tylluan Penry View Post
        Yes, I see what you're saying. With regard to Corbin's question, I think the west would mostly claim that man lives in history. But perhaps we need to consider that history lives in us too. It would certainly widen the way we view and interpret the world.
        Absolutely! We are what we make, and we make what we are. It's an ouroboros.

        I'm a big fan of Jung also. In one of the essays in Modern Man in Search of a Soul (1958) he pointed out that, if enough people can not come to terms with their own shadow, we are all doomed... by which he meant: If we don't stop blaming others for everything we don't like, we'll probably kill ourselves in a big. bloody war.

        That's probably one of the most important things I've learned in my life.
        Every moment of a life is a horrible tragedy, a slapstick comedy, dark nihilism, golden illumination, or nothing at all; depending on how we write the story we tell ourselves.

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          #19
          Re: Difference between Archetype and God?

          Originally posted by B. de Corbin View Post
          Absolutely! We are what we make, and we make what we are. It's an ouroboros.

          I'm a big fan of Jung also. In one of the essays in Modern Man in Search of a Soul (1958) he pointed out that, if enough people can not come to terms with their own shadow, we are all doomed... by which he meant: If we don't stop blaming others for everything we don't like, we'll probably kill ourselves in a big. bloody war.

          That's probably one of the most important things I've learned in my life.
          Oh yes... and it's terrifying, isn't it?
          www.thewolfenhowlepress.com


          Phantom Turnips never die.... they just get stewed occasionally....

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            #20
            Re: Difference between Archetype and God?

            Originally posted by Tylluan Penry View Post
            Oh yes... and it's terrifying, isn't it?
            Yes, and yet it's exactly what we humans keep doing, both in micro- and macrocosm, over and over.
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            Can you hear me, Major Tom? I think I love you.

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              #21
              Re: Difference between Archetype and God?

              To get back on track, though, here's a little test to find out which of the 12 main Jungian archetypes you are living out:

              http://www.quibblo.com/quiz/9LSyEqA/...are-you-Living


              Note - when you get to the last question, DO NOT pick "none of the above" or it won't show you results. You will get a pop up, though.


              I got The Lover, baby.
              Every moment of a life is a horrible tragedy, a slapstick comedy, dark nihilism, golden illumination, or nothing at all; depending on how we write the story we tell ourselves.

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                #22
                Re: Difference between Archetype and God?

                I got the Creator....
                www.thewolfenhowlepress.com


                Phantom Turnips never die.... they just get stewed occasionally....

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                  #23
                  Re: Difference between Archetype and God?

                  Originally posted by B. de Corbin View Post
                  To get back on track, though, here's a little test to find out which of the 12 main Jungian archetypes you are living out:

                  http://www.quibblo.com/quiz/9LSyEqA/...are-you-Living


                  Note - when you get to the last question, DO NOT pick "none of the above" or it won't show you results. You will get a pop up, though.


                  I got The Lover, baby.
                  Magician, well in specific areas it works.
                  life itself was a lightsaber in his hands; even in the face of treachery and death and hopes gone cold, he burned like a candle in the darkness. Like a star shining in the black eternity of space.

                  Yoda: Dark Rendezvous

                  "But those men who know anything at all about the Light also know that there is a fierceness to its power, like the bare sword of the law, or the white burning of the sun." Suddenly his voice sounded to Will very strong, and very Welsh. "At the very heart, that is. Other things, like humanity, and mercy, and charity, that most good men hold more precious than all else, they do not come first for the Light. Oh, sometimes they are there; often, indeed. But in the very long run the concern of you people is with the absolute good, ahead of all else..."

                  John Rowlands, The Grey King by Susan Cooper

                  "You come from the Lord Adam and the Lady Eve", said Aslan. "And that is both honour enough to erect the head of the poorest beggar, and shame enough to bow the shoulders of the greatest emperor on earth; be content."

                  Aslan, Prince Caspian by CS Lewis


                  Comment

                    #24
                    Re: Difference between Archetype and God?

                    Yeah, that's the box I'm usually placed in...

                    Magician
                    Magician quiz

                    You are a magical personality! You were probably the best a hide and seek when you were a kid. You believe in magic and fairy tales and dragons! You are usually the person who can make the impossible possible. Others probably seek you for a quick fix to a nasty issue, and you're the one to come through!
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                    "...leave me curled up in my ball,
                    surrounded by plush, downy things,
                    ill prepared, but willing,
                    to descend."

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                      #25
                      Re: Difference between Archetype and God?

                      Originally posted by B. de Corbin View Post
                      To get back on track, though, here's a little test to find out which of the 12 main Jungian archetypes you are living out:

                      http://www.quibblo.com/quiz/9LSyEqA/...are-you-Living


                      Note - when you get to the last question, DO NOT pick "none of the above" or it won't show you results. You will get a pop up, though.


                      I got The Lover, baby.
                      Ah poop. I'm on the computer at work and after putting in all my answers, I get 'warning, malicious content detected'.. My archetype: malicious content..
                      夕方に急なにわか雨は｢夕立」と呼ばれるなら、なぜ朝ににわか雨は｢朝立ち」と呼ばれないの？ ＾＾If a sudden rain shower in the evening is referred to as an 'evening stand', then why isn't a shower in the morning called 'morning stand'?

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                        #26
                        Re: Difference between Archetype and God?

                        Originally posted by AL!CE View Post
                        I already did. I'm waiting for someone (like the OP) to offer a good counter definition.
                        Originally Posted by AL!CE
                        Archetypes are types of God or Goddess. So for example Maiden, Mother and Crone are 3 archetypes. God of war is an archetype. Goddess of love is an archetype. Sky father... Dark mother... Hunter... Storm... you get the point. Each archetype will have several named Gods/Goddesses from a variety of pantheons under it.

                        well that sounds like a good enough definition to me

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                          #27
                          Re: Difference between Archetype and God?

                          Originally posted by Jembru View Post
                          Ah poop. I'm on the computer at work and after putting in all my answers, I get 'warning, malicious content detected'.. My archetype: malicious content..
                          I get "Content Blocked" so whats that make us?
                          http://catcrowsnow.blogspot.com/

                          But they were doughnuts of darkness. Evil damned doughnuts, tainted by the spawn of darkness.... Which could obviously only be redeemed by passing through the fiery inferno of my digestive tract.
                          ~Jim Butcher

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                            #28
                            Re: Difference between Archetype and God?

                            Originally posted by MaskedOne View Post
                            To randomly steal concepts from programming, archetypes are classes. Everything within a class has specific common traits and does specific things. Gods are objects built from those classes, each god will have the traits of the class it belongs to but those traits not appear identically to other gods of the same class.
                            This is pretty much what I'll have to side with. And with Corbin's Jung definition as well.
                            �Experience is what you get when you didn't get what you wanted. And experience is often the most valuable thing you have to offer.�
                            ― Randy Pausch, The Last Lecture
                            Sneak Attack
                            Avatar picture by the wonderful and talented TJSGrimm.

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                              #29
                              Re: Difference between Archetype and God?

                              Originally posted by AL!CE View Post
                              I'm not sure I agree with your definition of archetype. Archetypes are types of God or Goddess. So for example Maiden, Mother and Crone are 3 archetypes. God of war is an archetype. Goddess of love is an archetype. Sky father... Dark mother... Hunter... Storm... you get the point. Each archetype will have several named Gods/Goddesses from a variety of pantheons under it.
                              so how do we know if the Archetype is a God or only a psychological construct?

                              what is the difference?

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                                #30
                                Re: Difference between Archetype and God?

                                Originally posted by westwoden View Post
                                what is the difference?
                                Well, to someone with a hard polytheistic belief in deity, there's quite a bit of difference. To over simply, gods are divine beings and psychological constructs are imaginary friends. Personally I think its a heckofalot more nuanced than that, but for someone that believes that the gods aren't just an imaginary friend, the idea that other people consider their gods to be imaginary friends can be pretty irritating.

                                Originally posted by westwoden View Post
                                so how do we know if the Archetype is a God or only a psychological construct?
                                Does it matter?

                                I'm not saying this to be facetious, and I'm not saying that it isn't an interesting intellectual discussion...but at the end of the day, does it matter?

                                Does it matter if the Brigid you honor, or pray to or meditate on is an idea in your head or a real and thriving entity?
                                Wonderful Life: The Burgess Shale and the Nature of HistoryPagan Devotionals, because the wind and the rain is our Bible
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