Punishment as Deterrence

[Tylluan Penry]

Re: Punishment as Deterrence

What I don't understand is the other way -- abort babies, but don't kill criminals. I will never get that.

Exactly - and there are many people who try to reconcile the two, either the way you've just quoted, or the way I mentioned earlier.

***
On another tack slightly, what happens when society gets it wrong? I don't know the comparable cases in the US, but in the UK 'the Guildford Four' , 'The Birmingham Six' , 'The Cardiff Three' etc., are a kind of shorthand for miscarriages of justice. In these particular instances, those convicted were not hanged simply because the UK did not have the death penalty at that time. Otherwise they almost certainly would have been. And there are other cases where people were hanged and later found to be innocent.

Now, what happens when society commit wrongful murder? What happens to us, when it is done in our name? Because if we want a death penalty as an ultimate deterrent, then we have to be prepared for getting it wrong. Do we just shrug and say 'oh well, we did our best...'???

Cos I don't know about you, but I can't.

[thalassa]

Re: Punishment as Deterrence

I actually don't hold this view, being pro-death penalty and pro-choice (to a point), but I don't see any moral confusion. A baby is innocent. A convicted criminal is not.

What I don't understand is the other way -- abort babies, but don't kill criminals. I will never get that.

A fetus isn't a baby, and a decent number of people getting the death penalty are innocent...

Personally, I'm for both, with some limitations...so I don't see much of a moral dilemma there.

[Ophidia]

Re: Punishment as Deterrence

For example, many people who are pro-death penalty are also anti-abortion (not all,but it's just an example). How do you get that into a moral code that actually makes sense?

Even though I'm pro-choice, that makes perfect sense to me. A fetus (or a newly formed clump of cells) isn't a self-determining grown adult, capable of knowing right from wrong.

[ChainLightning]

Re: Punishment as Deterrence

TL;DR

Letting my sarcasm take control, 3 hots and a cot may not be punishment. Capital punishment may just be cultural murder. Either of these could represent a positive reinforcement, instead of deterrence.





Has that been said already? Okay. I'll keep quiet, now.

[KarrinMurphy]

Re: Punishment as Deterrence

I think one of the reasons a lot of people end up being repeat offenders (aside from racial inequality and poverty) is that we focus too much on punishment and not enough on rehabilitation. Jail time becomes little more than personal retribution from the affected parties.

If you teach your kid not to do bad stuff because they might get caught and be punished, all it teaches them is to be sneakier. Not doing bad things becomes a matter of self-preservation. People need to understand why certain things are bad, and they must develop a sense of empathy for others, or else the consequences of their actions are irrelevant to them so long as they don't get caught.

Punishment is a deterrent, but I think it's a lot less effective than the alternative.

[Chris]

Re: Punishment as Deterrence

People need to understand why certain things are bad, and they must develop a sense of empathy for others, or else the consequences of their actions are irrelevant to them so long as they don't get caught.

i go with this...my views entirely,

unless the individual views their action as wrong then nothing will change punishment or not....

will humanity ever stop this materialist i want so i will take attitude - probably not

[Medusa]

Re: Punishment as Deterrence

The people who are repeat offenders usually are just stupid criminals.

[B. de Corbin]

Re: Punishment as Deterrence

Here's a thought.

If we can agree that violent offenders need to be (at least temporarily) removed from society, does it matter if we call it "punishment," "justice," "socially necessary segregation," or "burrito"?

[thalassa]

Re: Punishment as Deterrence

We can only call it burrito, if we wrap them in giant tortillas. Which is fine with me, it would creat a new industry, and jobs.

[B. de Corbin]

Re: Punishment as Deterrence

We can only call it burrito, if we wrap them in giant tortillas. Which is fine with me, it would creat a new industry, and jobs.

I'm a strong advocate of wrapping violent repeat offenders in giant tortillas.

Countries where this has been tried have seen a 130% reduction in crime.

(The extra 30% comes from hardened criminals giving back stolen money and returning deceased victims to life.)

[ChainLightning]

Re: Punishment as Deterrence

Absolutely!


And a sentence is a collection of words.

[Rowanwood]

Re: Punishment as Deterrence

I'm a strong advocate of wrapping violent repeat offenders in giant tortillas.

Countries where this has been tried have seen a 130% reduction in crime.

(The extra 30% comes from hardened criminals giving back stolen money and returning deceased victims to life.)

I like my criminals with guacamole. It makes everything more palatable.

[Chris]

Re: Punishment as Deterrence

I'm a strong advocate of wrapping violent repeat offenders in giant tortillas.

does that come with salsa ??

[B. de Corbin]

Re: Punishment as Deterrence

does that come with salsa ??

What are you? A barbarian?

[Chris]

Re: Punishment as Deterrence

What are you? A barbarian?

absofragginlutelygodsdammit

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i also like crunchy nut cornflakes and custard...so hey