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Ahmed the Clock Maker
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Head Above Water
- Dec 2011
- 3034
- Ecletic Pagan
- Southeast Michigan
- There is no mastery--only constant improvement.
Re: Ahmed the Clock Maker
Update in Irving, Texas: Kids are no longer allowed to make anything wire wire, metal, plastic, wood, glass, or that requires a screwdriver, just in case it's a bomb.
Seriously, though, that poor kid. I would have shown it off to all of my teachers, because I would have been so proud of making it.
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Dragon Lady
- Apr 2012
- 827
- eclectic Heathen
- female
- Ohio
- Its not about finding the "right path" but more so finding the path that's right for you
Re: Ahmed the Clock Maker
I saw this earlier this morning on tumblr, and I was so upset. It's utterly ridiculous and bullshit that they would do that to a poor kid just because of his race. I would've applauded him, cause I know I sure couldn't manage to do something like that at 14, or even now without someone else's help along the way teaching me how to do it.Always taking art commissions, especially for fantasy and pagan related artwork
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The Gaze of the Abyss
- Feb 2007
- 9295
- Alchemist and Neo-American Redneck Buddhist
- Frozen Northern Michigan, near Thunder Bay
- Where are the tweezers?
Re: Ahmed the Clock Maker
Big problem, not good, major snafu, highly embarrassing...
'course, had it been some kid with an actual bomb (maybe not someone named Ahmed, maybe a kid named Buford) and nothing had been done, and 40 kids & teachers were blown to bloody shreds, that, also would have been a big problem, not good, major snafu, highly embarrassing.
Either a thing that looks like a bomb is treated like a bomb until you find out it is a clock, or a thing that looks like a bomb is treated like a clock until it explodes.
I'm not sure this is as much about racism as people would like it to be; I would like to politely suggest that this is more about safety.
I think that no matter what the people who are charged with the protection of citizens do, there is some way in which somebody who wants to will be able to accuse them of being pricks, either because they were careful, or because they weren't.
I do not think that is a right game for adults to play.Every moment of a life is a horrible tragedy, a slapstick comedy, dark nihilism, golden illumination, or nothing at all; depending on how we write the story we tell ourselves.
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Head Above Water
- Dec 2011
- 3034
- Ecletic Pagan
- Southeast Michigan
- There is no mastery--only constant improvement.
Re: Ahmed the Clock Maker
Originally posted by B. de Corbin View PostBig problem, not good, major snafu, highly embarrassing...
'course, had it been some kid with an actual bomb (maybe not someone named Ahmed, maybe a kid named Buford) and nothing had been done, and 40 kids & teachers were blown to bloody shreds, that, also would have been a big problem, not good, major snafu, highly embarrassing.
Either a thing that looks like a bomb is treated like a bomb until you find out it is a clock, or a thing that looks like a bomb is treated like a clock until it explodes.
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Copper Member
- Apr 2014
- 986
- That one where I can play with live snakes and speak gibberish.
- Mobile, Alabama
Re: Ahmed the Clock Maker
Originally posted by B. de Corbin View PostBig problem, not good, major snafu, highly embarrassing...
'course, had it been some kid with an actual bomb (maybe not someone named Ahmed, maybe a kid named Buford) and nothing had been done, and 40 kids & teachers were blown to bloody shreds, that, also would have been a big problem, not good, major snafu, highly embarrassing.
Either a thing that looks like a bomb is treated like a bomb until you find out it is a clock, or a thing that looks like a bomb is treated like a clock until it explodes.
I'm not sure this is as much about racism as people would like it to be; I would like to politely suggest that this is more about safety.
I think that no matter what the people who are charged with the protection of citizens do, there is some way in which somebody who wants to will be able to accuse them of being pricks, either because they were careful, or because they weren't.
I do not think that is a right game for adults to play.
If any other kid who had made a clock who's name was not Ahmed would have came in to class with it nothing would have happened.
And even after it was quite clear that it was nothing more than a clock they still lead him away in handcuffs and they still said they might charge him. This wasn't a public safety matter it was a matter of fear. And even after they knew they were wrong they were still ton cowardly noon let the boy be and took him to jail. Yeah, they were pricks.
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Re: Ahmed the Clock Maker
Sure racial profiling but can you blame people for being nervous when they know the tactics used by people of that background (even the use of children). Any other people who are of a certain race or background would be viewed the same if they had carried out numerous terrorist acts in such a way. Many races in the world have had their turn on the chopping block, its just their turn. I know how my family is viewed for being jewish especially my grandparents having lived through WWII. It may sound insensitive but someone is always blamed for the folly of another including an entire race of people.
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The Gaze of the Abyss
- Feb 2007
- 9295
- Alchemist and Neo-American Redneck Buddhist
- Frozen Northern Michigan, near Thunder Bay
- Where are the tweezers?
Re: Ahmed the Clock Maker
Originally posted by ThePaganMafia View PostExcept they were being pricks. This was racism.
If any other kid who had made a clock who's name was not Ahmed would have came in to class with it nothing would have happened.
And even after it was quite clear that it was nothing more than a clock they still lead him away in handcuffs and they still said they might charge him. This wasn't a public safety matter it was a matter of fear. And even after they knew they were wrong they were still ton cowardly noon let the boy be and took him to jail. Yeah, they were pricks.
I work in a school. I know the policies that schools are required, by federal law, to have in place.
If I see something suspicious, I am required, by law, to report it, and the school officials are required, by law, to investigate. If I see someone has scrawled "I'm gonna burn this place down" on a bathroom wall, I have to report it, the school officials have to notify the police, and they have to track the kid down and make sure it was just idle potty talk.
Last year I found a scrap of paper that had a list of the three items used to make a malatov cocktail a bottle, a rag, gasoline. I had to - for both legal and moral reasons - to report it. The school officials had to investigate. As I expected, there was no real threat.
But IF I had not reported it, and IF some kid had chucked a malatov cocktail down a crowded hallway, I would have been legally AND morally responsible for any injury. Race, skin color, religion, ethnicity - none of these had anything to do with it at all.
Habbalah - the teacher who knew about it was not the one who reported it. But he knew it looked suspicious. He told the kid not to show it to anybody.Every moment of a life is a horrible tragedy, a slapstick comedy, dark nihilism, golden illumination, or nothing at all; depending on how we write the story we tell ourselves.
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Re: Ahmed the Clock Maker
Originally posted by Kiesha'ra View PostSure racial profiling but can you blame people for being nervous when they know the tactics used by people of that background (even the use of children).
Did anyone call the Westboro Baptist Church terrorists when they were picketing gay funerals and spreading hate and bigotry all over the USA? No. Most people realized that they were using their 'faith' as a means to an end.
Originally posted by Kiesha'ra View PostAny other people who are of a certain race or background would be viewed the same if they had carried out numerous terrorist acts in such a way.
Racism is always wrong. Accusing a child, one with an amazing gift, of being a terrorist because of his name and ethnic background is absolutely unconscionable.
Originally posted by Kiesha'ra View PostMany races in the world have had their turn on the chopping block, its just their turn.No one tells the wind which way to blow.
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Re: Ahmed the Clock Maker
If tou take a home-made clock to a movie theater the same thing will happen to you. This was not about race or religion. this was a home-made device that should have been cleared through the office before it was taken anywhere else in the school. It appears, on all levels, to be a suspicious device. It could have been opened in the office revealing it to be a harmless clock. Then the outcome of this story, at the end of that school day, would have been very different.The Dragon sees infinity and those it touches are forced to feel the reality of it.
I am his student and his partner. He is my guide and an ominous friend.
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Silver Member
- Oct 2010
- 3338
- solitary pagan witch with a strong interest in Anglo Saxons
- South Wales Valleys, UK
- Phantom Turnips never die. They just get stewed occasionally....
Re: Ahmed the Clock Maker
It was a clock. He was a Muslim. His parents were not called. He was not offered an attorney. The school in question was chartered to promote innovation - remember that too.
Now, if you honestly believe that this is only about health and safety, (partly, it may well have been) I would remind you that THIS is how you create terrorists.
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The Gaze of the Abyss
- Feb 2007
- 9295
- Alchemist and Neo-American Redneck Buddhist
- Frozen Northern Michigan, near Thunder Bay
- Where are the tweezers?
Re: Ahmed the Clock Maker
Originally posted by Tylluan Penry View PostIt was a clock.
But what is your score on foresight? Are you qualified to make a definitive determination on whether such an object is a bomb or a clock? Or would you take a chance with the lives of other people's children in order to be proudly PC?
Now, if you honestly believe that this is only about health and safety, (partly, it may well have been) I would remind you that THIS is how you create terrorists.
Do incidents like this create terrorists? Hmmm... That seems one sided...
If incidents like this create terrorists, one needs to also admit that terrorists are responsible for creating incidents like this. I remember the days when only Isreal had armed guards in airports...
IMHO - I think terrorists are created when some group decides they can point a finger at another group and accuse them of being evil, without admitting that the finger pointer is at least partially responsible for creating the situation.
I think that is much more realistic...Every moment of a life is a horrible tragedy, a slapstick comedy, dark nihilism, golden illumination, or nothing at all; depending on how we write the story we tell ourselves.
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Silver Member
- Oct 2010
- 3338
- solitary pagan witch with a strong interest in Anglo Saxons
- South Wales Valleys, UK
- Phantom Turnips never die. They just get stewed occasionally....
Re: Ahmed the Clock Maker
We saw it a lot over here in the UK during the IRA bombing campaign in the mainland. A LOT of prejudice. A LOT of hate. Some was justified. Most was not. It did create massive resentment. And resentment does tend to breed terrorists.
This is how the narrative will go for other bright children... 'Don't bother telling your school or showing them how bright you are because you are a Muslim and they will arrest you. Instead, come and help your brothers, and they will respect you for your genius.'
But, in my view, this child took his clock to show his teacher. It was a clever thing to make at that age. If he had been suspect for other reasons (terrorists in the family etc.) then I think they would have been justified in leaping to conclusions.
But - and this was my main gripe, once he was arrested, his parents should have been informed and he should have had an attorney present. Correct me if I'm wrong, but this was not done. And if it was not done, then terrorist or not, it should have been.
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