The Evolution Thread

[thalassa]

...because we don't have one yet, and its bound to happen anyway...

[Corvus]

Re: The Evolution Thread

Isn't it evolution as in mokey is to people,dinosaur is to bird?

[Dufonce]

Re: The Evolution Thread

its bacteria to cell to fish to amphibian to lizards/birds to mammals.

and ape to neanderthal to human progression too...

[Corvus]

Re: The Evolution Thread

So are we supposed to discuss why or why not evolution exsists? Or something like that...

[Dufonce]

Re: The Evolution Thread

I believe in adaptation over time. and natural selection (until smart people started caring about stupid people)

at work sometimes when people cant operate an ice/water machine... i kinda hope they dehydrate and die... but thats mean.

[Corvus]

Re: The Evolution Thread

Darwin theorized natural selection was the driveing force behind evolution, that the progressive adaptation of a species created a new species. Sounds good enough for me.

[Madness]

Re: The Evolution Thread

*ahem* On topic...

I found this interesting. As I've heard in the past, the US is the hotbed for the evolution debate. Here's a good graph to represent that:



And the article says the acceptance of evolution has dropped 5% in the last 20 years despite an increase in education level in the US.

[Corvus]

Re: The Evolution Thread

That is weird an increase in church attendance maybe?

[Dufonce]

Re: The Evolution Thread

Excerpt from Wikipedia on Evolution:

Two main processes cause variants to become more common or rarer in a population. One is natural selection, through which traits that aid survival and reproduction become more common, while traits that hinder survival and reproduction become rarer. Natural selection occurs because only a small proportion of individuals in each generation will survive and reproduce, since resources are limited and organisms produce many more offspring than their environment can support. Over many generations, heritable variation in traits is filtered by natural selection and the beneficial changes are successively retained through differential survival and reproduction. This iterative process adjusts traits so they become better suited to an organism's environment: these adjustments are called adaptations.

Natural selection is a part of the theory of evolution. Sorry I didn't know subtopics were off topic from broad topics. I was trying to figure out how we were getting off topic. The topic was started left WIDE OPEN, hell it started off-topic. If we were given an aspect of evolution we were supposed to discuss then maybe we could discuss it, we went with natural selection, it went slightly off topic but still within the topic.

Please, give us something to discuss, or we will end up with our random spouts on different aspects. Sorry if this upsets you.

[B. de Corbin]

Re: The Evolution Thread

[quote author=Madness link=topic=635.msg9378#msg9378 date=1288735872]
And the article says the acceptance of evolution has dropped 5% in the last 20 years despite an increase in education level in the US.
[/quote]

Did it suggest any possible explanations for it? That kind of thing is troubling.

And, just out of curiosity (because I have to ask - It's SCIENCE! ), did it make any statements as to how the question was asked, and to what group? For example, if it were a phone survey given to people who subscribe to National Enquirer I'm not going to worry about it nearly as much as I will if it was in a written survey given to people as they graduate from state universities...

[Madness]

Re: The Evolution Thread

[quote author=B. de Corbin link=topic=635.msg9406#msg9406 date=1288740624]
Did it suggest any possible explanations for it? That kind of thing is troubling.[/quote]

I finally found the actual study instead of just blogs linking to it. There are no concrete conclusions drawn, but there is an interesting table of factors that effect the response (page 8). The bottom line: the more religious you are, the less you accept evolution. The more literate you are in genetics, the more you accept evolution. So it's kind of a tautology if you ask me.

Here's the textual conclusions for why the US is different than Europe:

And, just out of curiosity (because I have to ask - It's SCIENCE! ), did it make any statements as to how the question was asked, and to what group?

The main question was: "Human beings, as we know them, developed from earlier species of animals." (true, false, unknown/not sure).

One thing they were specifically testing was giving the question a clear black and white. In other polls, they were given 5 possible answers ranging in certainty. In those only 14% thought evolution was "definitely true."

(source)

[Juniper]

Re: The Evolution Thread

I have stripped the non-useful posts in the hopes of getting an actual discussion going here.

Please remember that this is in Academics and while it is not a debate, sources for your references are still encouraged.

I realize that this is a broad subject without any direct focus, but please keep discussions within a reasonable range. If you feel that a particular part of this topic needs more attention, I encourage you to start a new topic for that purpose.

Thank you.

[thalassa]

Re: The Evolution Thread

Wow, I go to vote, pick my kid up from school, go to work and have dinner at my grandma's and the joint explodes. WTF. Anyhoo...



Evolution.

Theodosius Dobzhansky (famous biologist dude known for much work with fruit flies and the development of the Modern Synthesis--which is what bio-geeks call modern evolution) wrote that "Nothing in biology makes sense except in the light of evolution." And he is quite right, if one looks at the development of biology from natural history during the 1800's.



But...what *is* evolution?

Modern evolution is defined as "a change in allele frequencies over time" (from Evolutionary Analysis, Fifth Ed by Freeman and Herron)...in English this simply means that evolution is a change in the number of organisms in a population that express a particular genetic code over time. There are a series of mechanisms by which this evolution can occur...from random mutation (a possible origin of genetic differences in an organism) to sexual selection (how organisms choose mates).
(further discussion on this topic)



Then what about this Darwin guy?

Charles Darwin proposed the Theory of Evolution by Natural Selection, which created one of the original definitions of evolution (descent with modification) and offered a mechanism by which it occurred (natural selection, sometimes known as "selection of the fittest&quot. Charles Darwin is not the originator of the idea of evolution...or even the idea of natural selection, rather he was the first to articulate them in a organized and logical manner with a shit ton of evidence to back them up. Quite simply, Darwin was one of the first persons (and he shares his first published paper...having sat on the idea for 20 years...with the forgotten Alfred Russel Wallace) to treat the idea of Evolution to scientific empiricism. From a modern perspective, Darwin got a lot right. He also got a lot wrong (none of which negates evolution).




Yeah...but evolution is just a theory.

Well...yeah. It is "just" a theory--a scientific theory to be precise...which is a helluva lot different than "just a theory" in the common vernacular. As discussed in the Science vs Religion thread, scientific theories "are structures of ideas that explain and interpret facts" (qtd from palentologist and evolutionary biologist Steven Jay Gould). They are supported by data and can be used to make predictions. Which takes us back to Dobzhansky...every single sub-discipline within the field of biology depends on evolution as a fact, or supports evolution as a theory (and sometimes both).

[B. de Corbin]

Re: The Evolution Thread

[quote author=Madness link=topic=635.msg9429#msg9429 date=1288742934]
...The bottom line: the more religious you are, the less you accept evolution. The more literate you are in genetics, the more you accept evolution. So it's kind of a tautology if you ask me....[/quote]

[quote author=thalassa link=topic=635.msg9486#msg9486 date=1288753734]
..."Nothing in biology makes sense except in the light of evolution." And he is quite right, if one looks at the development of biology from natural history during the 1800's. [/quote]

Put these these two ideas together, and I think you get a good picture of the problem. Evolutionary theory has such enormous explanatory and predictive power that, on the one hand, if you reject it, you need some kind of Big Magic to fill the void, while on the other hand, if you believe in the Big Magic, your "evidence for belief" faces a serious challenge from the explanatory and predictive power of evolutionary theory.

[Simon Slade]

Re: The Evolution Thread

Isn't Darwinism a religion? And don't they worship the devil?

Sorry . . .
/troll

To be constructive: I found this and I think that it explains evolution and the confusion surrounding it pretty well: http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/evol...efinition.html

I would post more, but I have to catch the bus in fifteen minutes.