Fate & Destiny

[nbdy]

Re: Fate & Destiny

This reminds me of an argument made against one of the Star Trek shows (I want to say Voyager, but I think it cropped up in a few of the series' ) with the crew interacting with their dopplegangers from "Opposite-Land". One of the things that was pointed out was that if in the "real world" you have a couple "A" and "B", perhaps "A" is a doctor and "B" got their start as an x-ray tech, they hit it off, they get married, and they have a kid. Even if you assume that that other Universe is so fundamentally different that things mostly turn out the same, let me pose this to you:

A & B are a couple, they have a kid C.
D & E are also a couple (the same couple, really), and they have a kid F.

Now let's say in this second reality, that E is killed - heart attack, hit by a starship, whatever. Does that mean that couple A & B can now NEVER have an additional kid? Since the opposite "couple" no longer exists, in order to maintain consistency between the Universes (allowing dopplegangers to continue existing) the freedom to choose one's destiny is yanked from their grasp.

Roknrol, an interesting idea came to mind as I read about the alternate reality scenario -- why would there be only one alternate reality? Why wouldn't there be a reality for every possible combination of choices ever made? Then everything is pre-ordained because every possible outcome exists. What changes, then, is our consciousness, which "reality" we experience.

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Wow, Rae'ya, great post. I put it in a text file for future reference. I think that perspective captures both the agency I feel each person has and the sense of determinacy that I think we've all experienced.

[Gleb]

Re: Fate & Destiny

Reality is different for everyone. It changes along the years.
LunarHarvest, I thought that the two are reversed. Interesting opinion. Perhaps it depends on the context we use these two words in. So the definition varies. What do you think?

[feathered_regalia]

Re: Fate & Destiny

I love that description of fate and destiny . My opinion on the matter is somewhere in the middle. I believe there are energies that influence us from birth to death. If we are able to find those energies, then we can see what is coming our way and how it will influence our lives. We can then choose to go with the flow, or find a way to prevent or skirt around an event we may not want to suffer. As far as what we are meant to do with our lives: I think as long as we're doing what makes us feel like a "whole" person, we're doing what it is that we're meant to do. I don't think there's anything like "You're supposed to be out preaching in the hills of Malaysia, for it's in the cards..." But I do believe in, "The way things are going right now, it looks like you're going to end up here unless you do something to change that." And just becoming aware of that gives you the power to change it, so, when a reading doesn't turn out to be accurate, I don't think the fault is always the reader. That's, of course, of speaking of fate and destiny in relation to astrology and tarot and ogham or runes or... the list... big list... Lol.

[Roknrol]

Re: Fate & Destiny

What I'm curious about is why we think that there must be something such as "fate" or "destiny". Myself included - despite not believing in either, I am still prone to thinking that certain "what if's" would have been impossible. Many of my realities hinge on one specific event, that should I have changed that particular event - say, joining the Navy instead of the Army, or not joining at all, or not getting involved with theater - that would have made a meeting between myself and my wife impossible. Not improbable. Impossible. Not only would the likelihood of our meeting be completely outside of the realm of possibility, my wife and I both attribute that first night that we met to be a one-off night for both of us. We both happened to be in the right mood, in the right place, at the right time, neither of us had planned on meeting the other, neither of us was looking for a relationship. Yet 15 years later, here we are.

It's difficult to imagine how different of a person I would be had any of those decisions been made differently, or rendered impossible due to a thousand other little events.

So seeing "fate" or "destiny"...um..."at work" so to speak is difficult to refute and impossible to ignore.

Yet...

In the cosmic scale - really the only one that matters, IMO, we are a blip. We are an impossibly tiny blip, on a nondescript planet, in a nondescript solar system, in a generally average galaxy that is neither young, nor old. Cosmically. And the true challenge for me is wondering what makes me so special that the Universe has bent itself around a corner to accommodate me.

That's where it falls apart for me. We are living on a planet with 7 billion + people, most of which are suffering...and I'm supposed to believe that an invisible force is lining things up just so...because I'm...???

A guy. Just some random, mostly invisible guy. Nah. If fate or destiny worked properly at all I'd have hit the lottery by now.

[Gleb]

Re: Fate & Destiny

I don't know about the lottery - if everybody would have hit it, nobody would get a big amount of money, right? 'Cause that's what lottery is for.
BUT! If we determine what is what (fate & destiny), maybe we can change the reality after all. Or maybe every individual has to do it by himself.
I believe that the planet's history is written in the timeline, but how things will be going and done - it's another story.

[nbdy]

Re: Fate & Destiny

Time vexes me, and the ideas of fate and destiny rely on time. Time is a construct, a contingency. Theoretically, even without jumping dimensions, we can outrun time. Whatever this consciousness is that I experience sees today because I have chosen to look with the eyes of today. If this consciousness persists outside of space-time, then theoretically I could look anywhere, yet I am choosing to look at today. Perhaps fate is not having a choice? I don't know. But if I let myself get this crazy it becomes obvious that the flow of time from past to future is also a construct. Perhaps actions today ripple not only into the future but into the past, and that gives the illusion of fate. I don't know. All I know is what I have experienced, and no existing explanatory structures are sufficient.