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Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

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    #16
    Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

    Hi Yoey! I think we're in the same spot in a way. I'm currently a Christian, but I'm not convinced that Christianity is the ONLY Way anymore. To address your question about Hell: My church had a guest speaker visit who is a Christian but also has a Rabbi and has learnt Hebrew. His name is Shane Willard. During one of his sermons, he questioned the idea of why Hell is so important for Christians to believe in. At the time, I closed my mind to it because it seemed so counter to core teachings. Later, my Jewish friend confirmed to me that in some Jewish sects, Hell does not exist. After this, I could stop ignoring Jesus's parables of being 'allowed out of Hell' after a certain amount of time. Eternal damnation doesn't seem to fit with those parables. So, now the questions are more about what that place might actually be. Since parables are not literal, maybe this place is not either. I'm going to email Shane and ask. So if you'd like, I'll share with you what he tells me (if he replies). Since reading through the forums here, I've come to understand how my own faith has been influenced by so many others. Christianity is not a catalyst.

    At the moment, in my 'back-slidden' state (seeker state, which would imo actually indicate spritual growth), I'm leaning on the verse Romans 8:38,39. There is nothing that can separate me from the love of God anywhere, ever, at all. Because a sacrifice has already been made, He freely gives. I FREELY accept (ie I don't have to act a certain way or hold to certain beliefs).
    My affirmation is that God IS love, and that s/he is in everything and through everything.
    Many pagan paths are an honoring of or worship of nature. I like the way Weymouth New Testament translates col 1:17:
    And He is before all things and in and through Him the universe is a harmonious whole.

    Westwoden is onto something here, too. It's so very hard to leave behind Christianity because of the psychology in it. I wondered if I were the one who was decieved (the Bible predicts deceived people will walk away from the faith). In the end, I figure I can't follow God without asking questions. If God honours truth so much, He won't mind me being a seeker and He won't blame me for what I discover.

    I encourage you in your quest. Even ask the Holy Spirit for guidance as you search until you find what you're looking for. Maybe you will give your deity a new name or maybe you won't.

    Be blessed! I look forward to reading about your journey if you choose to disclose to us

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      #17
      Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

      I think the Christian God is an enormous dick and I would rather go to hell than Worship him. I can believe in the existence of an entity named Jehova, just as easily as I can believe in any other named God but I don't believe some of the claims he makes (or others make for him) about himself.

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        #18
        Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

        Originally posted by AL!CE View Post
        I think the Christian God is an enormous dick and I would rather go to hell than Worship him. I can believe in the existence of an entity named Jehova, just as easily as I can believe in any other named God but I don't believe some of the claims he makes (or others make for him) about himself.
        Enormous dick? I see your Christian God and I raise you Cerne Abbis.

        Seriously though, come on.. I know very little about Christianity, but didn't he chill out a lot in the New Testiment? Having kids can do that you know. It gives you perspective. It's not fair to judge someone on their past actions if they really worked hard to change. Jesus is pretty cool too. I liked it when he used his ninja death stars.. that was keewl.

        I said seriously didn't I? I wasn't being all that serious, but really, don't blame the deities or idols.. blame the corrupt and power hungry religious leaders.
        夕方に急なにわか雨は「夕立」と呼ばれるなら、なぜ朝ににわか雨は「朝立ち」と呼ばれないの? ^^If a sudden rain shower in the evening is referred to as an 'evening stand', then why isn't a shower in the morning called 'morning stand'?

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          #19
          Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

          How can an "all knowing" God grow as a person?

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            #20
            Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

            Originally posted by AL!CE View Post
            I think the Christian God is an enormous dick and I would rather go to hell than Worship him. I can believe in the existence of an entity named Jehova, just as easily as I can believe in any other named God but I don't believe some of the claims he makes (or others make for him) about himself.
            I'm unfamiliar with the god you worship. Can you tell me who it is?
            Satan is my spirit animal

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              #21
              Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

              Originally posted by AL!CE View Post
              How can an "all knowing" God grow as a person?
              I think he's more all seeing than all knowing. If he were all knowing, there is no way he'd have created the human race.

              Like I say, I know nothing about this god. I was kicked out of Sunday school very young and only did R.E. for 2 months of the year the rest of the time, that same one hour slot per week was PSE (personal and social education) and we never did Bible studies or anything like that. I don't even know what a psalm is, although I think it's a kind of prayer or Christian spell.

              I have no reason to dislike the Christian god though. Not always too keen on his followers, but really, the bad ones are the minority. I like that quote (was it Habbalah who had it as her sig?) by Ghandi, 'I like your Christ. I do not like your Christians, they are nothing like your Christ'. Or something like that. Sums up how I feel. I always say Jesus is a dude amongst dudes. Really nice chap. If he does return, I'll definitely get him a pint.
              夕方に急なにわか雨は「夕立」と呼ばれるなら、なぜ朝ににわか雨は「朝立ち」と呼ばれないの? ^^If a sudden rain shower in the evening is referred to as an 'evening stand', then why isn't a shower in the morning called 'morning stand'?

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                #22
                Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

                Originally posted by Jembru View Post
                I think he's more all seeing than all knowing.
                He claims to be both.

                - - - Updated - - -

                I went to Sunday-school for ages.

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                  #23
                  Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

                  I'm not sure there would be any need for an all-knowing God to grow as a person....
                  www.thewolfenhowlepress.com


                  Phantom Turnips never die.... they just get stewed occasionally....

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                    #24
                    Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

                    Originally posted by Tylluan Penry View Post
                    I'm not sure there would be any need for an all-knowing God to grow as a person....
                    My point is that as an all knowing God, if he's a dick in the Old testament then he would remain one in the New.

                    I tend to think that if Jesus is really not only the son of God but also "all powerful" "all knowing" God himself, then his whole crucifixion is really just a PR stunt. As an all knowing God he already knows every pain imaginable. As an all powerful God, death holds no fear for him. After all the Angel of Death is in his employ. So what did his crucifixion really achieve other than "Look what I'm doing for you!" PR stunt and I'm not falling for it. He's still a dick and/or less than he claims to be.

                    - - - Updated - - -

                    Sorry if I'm offending anyone. I'm probably a bit hung up on the Christianity thing due to my upbringing. I have issues both with Jehova and with my Christian Mother. I'm sure I'm not the only Pagan to have an annoyingly Christian Parent/s.

                    Jesus seems like an ok dude but he's supposed to be the same God. Jehova seriously has MPD.

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                      #25
                      Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

                      I generally treat the crucifixion less as payment for sin and more as a pointed statement that death != oblivion with a few other alterior motives added in.
                      life itself was a lightsaber in his hands; even in the face of treachery and death and hopes gone cold, he burned like a candle in the darkness. Like a star shining in the black eternity of space.

                      Yoda: Dark Rendezvous

                      "But those men who know anything at all about the Light also know that there is a fierceness to its power, like the bare sword of the law, or the white burning of the sun." Suddenly his voice sounded to Will very strong, and very Welsh. "At the very heart, that is. Other things, like humanity, and mercy, and charity, that most good men hold more precious than all else, they do not come first for the Light. Oh, sometimes they are there; often, indeed. But in the very long run the concern of you people is with the absolute good, ahead of all else..."

                      John Rowlands, The Grey King by Susan Cooper

                      "You come from the Lord Adam and the Lady Eve", said Aslan. "And that is both honour enough to erect the head of the poorest beggar, and shame enough to bow the shoulders of the greatest emperor on earth; be content."

                      Aslan, Prince Caspian by CS Lewis


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                        #26
                        Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

                        It's probably because I did Advertising and Marketing at University, that I see Jesus' crucifixion as a PR stunt, if for one moment we view the Christian God as real.

                        - - - Updated - - -

                        I might add a bloody good PR stunt that has helped gain Jesus a lot of "business".

                        If nothing else it is good advertising on the part of the Church: "Our God died for us. What did yours do for you?"

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                          #27
                          Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

                          I'll never put the LoH above using PR. I just don't normally treat it as his only motive.
                          life itself was a lightsaber in his hands; even in the face of treachery and death and hopes gone cold, he burned like a candle in the darkness. Like a star shining in the black eternity of space.

                          Yoda: Dark Rendezvous

                          "But those men who know anything at all about the Light also know that there is a fierceness to its power, like the bare sword of the law, or the white burning of the sun." Suddenly his voice sounded to Will very strong, and very Welsh. "At the very heart, that is. Other things, like humanity, and mercy, and charity, that most good men hold more precious than all else, they do not come first for the Light. Oh, sometimes they are there; often, indeed. But in the very long run the concern of you people is with the absolute good, ahead of all else..."

                          John Rowlands, The Grey King by Susan Cooper

                          "You come from the Lord Adam and the Lady Eve", said Aslan. "And that is both honour enough to erect the head of the poorest beggar, and shame enough to bow the shoulders of the greatest emperor on earth; be content."

                          Aslan, Prince Caspian by CS Lewis


                          Comment


                            #28
                            Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

                            I tend to think that maybe the Gods are playing a board game with the Earth as the board. Our freewill is an important game mechanic because we choose what God/s to play for. Thus Gods can use things like PR stunts to get more pieces.

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                              #29
                              Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

                              Originally posted by AL!CE View Post
                              It's probably because I did Advertising and Marketing at University, that I see Jesus' crucifixion as a PR stunt, if for one moment we view the Christian God as real.
                              Does this imply that your gods are real, but the Christian God is not? And if so, how can you delineate between what's real and not? What makes Hecate more real than God?


                              Mostly art.

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                                #30
                                Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

                                Originally posted by MaskedOne View Post
                                I'll never put the LoH above using PR. I just don't normally treat it as his only motive.
                                "LoH" ? What does that stand for?
                                sigpic
                                Can you hear me, Major Tom? I think I love you.

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