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Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

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    #31
    Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

    I tend to refer to the Abrahamic god as one of his titles, specifically, "Lord of Hosts" since I can't think of any other Power that commonly uses that descriptor. If I'm rushed or feeling lazy then I abreviate it to LoH.
    life itself was a lightsaber in his hands; even in the face of treachery and death and hopes gone cold, he burned like a candle in the darkness. Like a star shining in the black eternity of space.

    Yoda: Dark Rendezvous

    "But those men who know anything at all about the Light also know that there is a fierceness to its power, like the bare sword of the law, or the white burning of the sun." Suddenly his voice sounded to Will very strong, and very Welsh. "At the very heart, that is. Other things, like humanity, and mercy, and charity, that most good men hold more precious than all else, they do not come first for the Light. Oh, sometimes they are there; often, indeed. But in the very long run the concern of you people is with the absolute good, ahead of all else..."

    John Rowlands, The Grey King by Susan Cooper

    "You come from the Lord Adam and the Lady Eve", said Aslan. "And that is both honour enough to erect the head of the poorest beggar, and shame enough to bow the shoulders of the greatest emperor on earth; be content."

    Aslan, Prince Caspian by CS Lewis


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      #32
      Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

      I think all named Gods are fragments of the true divine. We cannot have a relationship with the divine in it's purest form as it so unlike us. So we must choose which fragments are worthy of our worship because that dictates our relationship with divinity.

      Hecate isn't realer than Jehova she's just better imo. She's more honest. She doesn't want us to be sheep. She wants us to learn and grow.

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        #33
        Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

        Originally posted by MaskedOne View Post
        I tend to refer to the Abrahamic god as one of his titles, specifically, "Lord of Hosts" since I can't think of any other Power that commonly uses that descriptor. If I'm rushed or feeling lazy then I abreviate it to LoH.
        OK, thanks for the explanation. That had actually occurred to me, but I didn't want to assume anything!
        sigpic
        Can you hear me, Major Tom? I think I love you.

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          #34
          Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

          Originally posted by AL!CE View Post
          I think all named Gods are fragments of the true divine. We cannot have a relationship with the divine in it's purest form as it so unlike us. So we must choose which fragments are worthy of our worship because that dictates our relationship with divinity.

          Hecate isn't realer than Jehova she's just better imo. She's more honest. She doesn't want us to be sheep. She wants us to learn and grow.
          Says one Christian to the other.

          Do you read what you write?
          Satan is my spirit animal

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            #35
            Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

            Originally posted by Medusa View Post
            Do you read what you write?
            It's nearly 4am, so no.

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              #36
              Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

              I think you're all WAY off track anyway. Get back on topic. Now!
              �Experience is what you get when you didn't get what you wanted. And experience is often the most valuable thing you have to offer.�
              ― Randy Pausch, The Last Lecture
              Sneak Attack
              Avatar picture by the wonderful and talented TJSGrimm.

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                #37
                Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

                Yes Miss.

                Originally posted by Yoey View Post
                Is there anyone on this forum who has dealt with the fear of going to hell because you are pagan?

                If so, how did you deal with it? If not, what do you suggest?
                Pagans don't believe in the Christian Hell. For one thing Hell the place belongs to the Goddess Hel and it's where all the non-warrior Vikings go. It's not a very nice place but it's not all fire and brimstone. It's more snake spit in the eyes.

                How to deal with a fear in hell? Simple you either stop believing in it and thus stop being afraid or you stop being a slave to your fears. I don't think faith should be built on fear.

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                  #38
                  Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

                  I just want to add, Yoey, that I became a Christian because I wanted to know God - not because I was afraid of going to Hell. This is still true for me even though my path deviates from a fundamental point of view. The first time I really had a spirtual path come alive to me was at a Christian youth group, even though I had first tried other things. If ever I'm called to a radically different way, I'd like to think I'll have the nerve to follow.
                  MaskedOne, could you elaborate on your understanding of the crucifixion? If its relevant to the thread, otherwise could you send me a private message about it?

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                    #39
                    Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

                    Originally posted by Yoey View Post
                    I was raised in a Christian church where we were that all pagans are going to hell, and that anything pagan is from a plot of satan to deceive the world so they will be in hell with him.
                    Certain forms of Christianity may teach this, and believe this. It is their right to do so. I would disagree, and point to historical circumstances and coincidence. But the kind of people who see everything around them as a Satanic plot aren't wont to see anything as coincidence.

                    I am at a point of uncertainty now because I don't want this to be true, but at the same time, I can't know for sure.
                    It's ontologically impossible to know anything for certain. Go with what you feel and experience, combined with what the data (historical, scientific, et al.) says.

                    Is there anyone on this forum who has dealt with the fear of going to hell because you are pagan?
                    No. I never believe in hell in the first place. And pagans (generally speaking) don't, because they're not Christians. Exceptions exist, usually when you expand "paganism" outside of the polytheistic framework, but for the most part--modern, contemporary Paganism does not believe in hell or any other Christian concept.

                    If not, what do you suggest?
                    "Find yourself" sound lame as fuck, but it's seriously good advice if you're confused or searching on questions as basic and fundamental as "does hell exist?", "do god(s) exist?", and "what is real?".

                    Originally posted by Yoey View Post
                    Well this path is calling me. I am trying to get beyond the warnings from modern conservative American Christianity that it is a path of evil and darkness.
                    It seems clear that you've made up your mind already, you're just uneasy because of the lack of absolute certainty.
                    It might be scary to come to grips with, but certainly is not possible. The closest you can get is what you feel. And if you feel that Christianity isn't right for you and that Paganism is what is calling you, religiously or spiritually, then do what you feel is best.

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                      #40
                      Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

                      Originally posted by AL!CE View Post
                      My point is that as an all knowing God, if he's a dick in the Old testament then he would remain one in the New.

                      I tend to think that if Jesus is really not only the son of God but also "all powerful" "all knowing" God himself, then his whole crucifixion is really just a PR stunt. As an all knowing God he already knows every pain imaginable. As an all powerful God, death holds no fear for him. After all the Angel of Death is in his employ. So what did his crucifixion really achieve other than "Look what I'm doing for you!" PR stunt and I'm not falling for it. He's still a dick and/or less than he claims to be.
                      This is interesting, AL!CE. It sounds like you might be influenced by Gnosticism. If you happen to take a peek at the recently translated Gospel of Judas, that's exactly what it is - a PR stunt. Judas is chosen to play the role of the eternal bad guy because he is the most loyal of the disciples.

                      As a person who could be described as a religious atheist, my view is this:

                      That the All Knowing can Be Growing is a metaphor, and not to be taken literally. What changes is our relation to the "ALL" (the ALL simply means everything, past, present, & future - and this is what I would call "God"). As we grow in knowledge and experience - both as individuals and as a species - our ability to grasp more of the ALL increases as if (here's the metaphor) the ALL had increased in these traits.
                      Every moment of a life is a horrible tragedy, a slapstick comedy, dark nihilism, golden illumination, or nothing at all; depending on how we write the story we tell ourselves.

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                        #41
                        Re: Christianity, Paganism, and Hell

                        Originally posted by Yoey View Post
                        I was raised in a Christian church where we were taught that all pagans are going to hell, and that anything pagan is from a plot of satan to deceive the world so they will be in hell with him.
                        I am at a point of uncertainty now because I don't want this to be true, but at the same time, I can't know for sure.
                        Is there anyone on this forum who has dealt with the fear of going to hell because you are pagan?
                        If so, how did you deal with it? If not, what do you suggest?
                        Figured I'd put my 2 cents into this. I can only speak for myself, but some people have found that to be insightful so it can't hurt.

                        I've never dealt with that fear, I suppose I always had this niggly feeling that while the church was doing the best it could to teach positive values, it was forgetting to mention something bigger that permeated everything. I knew it as a small child, and I know it now. It's not that their wrong, it's just that they never addressed the role of animals or nature to the extent that my life is entwined with those aspects.

                        When it comes to an afterlife where penance is due, there is no real equivalent in my belief system. We go to something similar to Summerland. But I do feel that at some point either before or after death that we are made aware, made to acknowledge, and made to balance any uneven points in our lives. Whether that happens via karma during this life, during another, or in the other realms, I can't really say. Like I said, just a feeling that makes some kind of sense to me. Maybe that's something of an equivalent minus the poky sticks carried by imps in red pajamas and the burning fires.

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