Pets chit chat thread

[Corvus]

Re: Pets chit chat thread

My request for fishies has been approved. They're going to be my birthday present. We've got a 10 or 15 (I don't remember which tank) downstairs from when my mom killed dozens of fish. I plan to run a cold water aquarium and I'll start with a few danios and some plants (I'm thinking moss maybe. I haven't really researched that too much yet) to begin cycling since I'm still a beginner and I hear they're quite forgiving.

[Rae'ya]

Re: Pets chit chat thread

My request for fishies has been approved. They're going to be my birthday present. We've got a 10 or 15 (I don't remember which tank) downstairs from when my mom killed dozens of fish. I plan to run a cold water aquarium and I'll start with a few danios and some plants (I'm thinking moss maybe. I haven't really researched that too much yet) to begin cycling since I'm still a beginner and I hear they're quite forgiving.

If you're a beginner DON'T GET GOLDFISH. They are labor intensive and make an enormous amount of waste and need heavy duty filtration. Plus people tend to put too many goldfish in a tank and then not have a good enough filter and then they die. Granted, they can put up with a lot of neglect before they die (excluding the ornamental ones), but far too many goldfish die every year because the pet shops make us think they're cheap and easy and sell us 'Beginner's Kits' that are woefully inadequate. And it just makes people think that goldfish are short lived... but they aren't. I usually kept Comets and Shubunkins because they were easy, and my oldest lived for about eight years - I was devastated when he died. I have a client who's large Fantail was almost twenty years old when we euthanased her last year!

Danios are a REALLY good choice. And they are so fun to watch. We always had Zebra Danios in with our Goldfish and affectionately called them 'zippy fish'. They love to play in the water streams from the filters, so make sure you have a good filter that will create a water stream or current, but wont be in danger of sucking them into the intake. Also try to have a tank that is long rather than tall. I'm not a fan of tall aquariums anyway, but Danios especially should have a horizontal space to swim in, because they like to zip around and play. If your existing tank is tall then they'll likely make do, but it's not ideal for Danios.

The problem with your parents being in control of getting you the fish and the bits and pieces is that you might be restricted in the kind of filter you'll be allowed to get. The expensive biological ones generally ARE better, and you generally CAN'T trust the pet shop people to know what they're talking about. You can get by with a cheap filter if they wont buy you a good one and you can't afford a good one yourself, but it might take more work with checking water quality etc. Filtration is really the key with aquarium keeping... if you can get the right filter for the tank with the right number of fish and the right feeding amounts then you can have a self-contained little ecosystem that hardly needs any work. But usually that takes either a good fluke, a slow start or years of experience. I fully admit I was never able to do that while we had goldfish. Once we decided not to replace the goldfish and to just stick with half a dozen Danios in our large tank, the environment was much better.

I could also never keep plants alive when I had goldfish... but then the primary reason I got plants was for the goldfish to have some environmental enrichment and grazing fodder... which of course needed even more filtration. We kept goldfish my entire life... I was personally in charge of the tank for like... ten years. And the best decision I ever made was to stop the goldfish and stick with the Danios. Much easier. lol. When hubby and I finally get an aquarium (we haven't had one since I moved out) we'll either have Danios again or try a tropical tank.

Wherever possible, buy from an aquarium store, NOT a pet store... preferably with staff who actually keep aquariums themselves. That way you are much more likely to get advice that is actually correct. Most good aquarium stores will also do free water quality checks and give you advice about what to tweak based on the results. You should check water quality yourself at home, and keep a log of results so that you can track trends. But if you have an aquarium store near you then take advantage of them!

Good luck! I really miss having a fishtank. The last three-four years has been the first time in my life I've not had fish and I'm really feeling it. So don't mind me if I live vicariously through your new tank

- - - Updated - - -

I have cuteness to post!

Two little baby kittens that my workmates and I are hand raising. They are cared for at work during the day, and then we are taking it in turns to take them home at night and on weekends.

They were found abandoned a a few weeks ago and we're estimating that they are four weeks old tomorrow.

This is them when I had them on Christmas Eve. My three year old nephew was absolutely entranced by them!
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This is them when I had them on Friday night.
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Between my workmates and I, we have a million photos, but it is SO hard to get a clear shot of them away. They absolutely refuse to sit still except for a snuggle after feeding and toileting. They're also old enough now that they are getting really interactive and starting to have some play and seeking us out for snuggles.

[Medusa]

Re: Pets chit chat thread

I used to get goldfish from the local carnival. All the of died over night. Meh.

I'm a cat lady. But we can't have pets really because I only have a bedroom. But we do have a very sweet and elderly, I think she's 8-12 years old now, mutt named poppy.

[Corvus]

Re: Pets chit chat thread

Thanks Rae'ya! I was aware goldfish are terrible beginner fish so I was leaning away from them, and telling everyone who said to get goldfish why they're a terrible idea. My dad wants to buy me a new tank but I keep telling him we should use the extra ones downstairs because of cost and there's no need to buy a new one if we have a perfectly fine one. I had to have a talk with my parents about long or tall tanks because my mom told dad to get one of the tall 5 gallons with a goldfish (remember she is the great murderer of fish) and I had to spend a good ten minutes explaining why that isn't really sufficient before my dad admitted he knows nothing about fish. A few seconds of googling has informed me that there's an aquarium and pet supply store downtown so I'll try to persuade my parents to look there rather than PetSmart, they also do free water checks according to their website.

I was considering setting up the tank and then having it run for a week or two with some fish food in it and no fish to try to get the bacteria going (then of course do a water change and put in some fish) before the fish go in. Then I can bring the water to be tested when I get my danios. Would you consider that a good idea?

I've also seen some sites that show danios having a wide enough temperature range to live in cold or tropical water. Could you start a cold aquarium with them then if you decided you wanted a tropical one, gradually turn up the temperature over a series of weeks? I ask because my favorite fish are fresh angels but since I'm a beginner I'd rather not start with them since I hear they're rather sensitive and they're difficulty is put under intermediate in all the pet stores.

How exactly do you test for ammonia and ph and things? I know of a few ways to test for ph but is there a meter or is it a one use thing or what? how could I do it myself and si it expensive? I'm not crazy about driving down just to get water tested every week.

[Rowanwood]

Re: Pets chit chat thread

I've had goldfish on and off since I was 12. The only reason I have none now is because my 55 gal tank broke and my 30 was already set up as tropical. If you care for them well, they can live a very long time. I had a carnival goldfish for 9 years (and he died when the tank broke...we tried to save them all, but we didn't make it.)

[Rae'ya]

Re: Pets chit chat thread

Thanks Rae'ya! I was aware goldfish are terrible beginner fish so I was leaning away from them, and telling everyone who said to get goldfish why they're a terrible idea.

Most of the problem is the pet stores... the starter kits are not worth the money you pay for them and lead people into a false sense of what is required to keep goldfish.

I was considering setting up the tank and then having it run for a week or two with some fish food in it and no fish to try to get the bacteria going (then of course do a water change and put in some fish) before the fish go in. Then I can bring the water to be tested when I get my danios. Would you consider that a good idea?

That is absolutely a good idea. You should always have your tank set up and starting to do it's thing before you put fish in it, and that can take 2-4 weeks. Set it up, stick in a bit of food (preferably in a stocking net so that you can pull it out once it's raised the ammonia. Then check your water quality every day... you're looking for the levels of ammonia and nitrite to drop, and you often have to raise the ammonia a few times. I can't remember the exact figures off the top of my head (it's been a long time since I started a tank from scratch) but some internet research should pull up some good sites with instructions for this.

Then you have to add the fish gradually and acclimatise them properly. Don't just dump them in at once. Put the bag in the water to let the temperature adjust, then put a little tank water in the bag and let them sit for five minutes, then a little more tank water... and then finally let them out into the tank after a couple of rounds of that.

I've also seen some sites that show danios having a wide enough temperature range to live in cold or tropical water. Could you start a cold aquarium with them then if you decided you wanted a tropical one, gradually turn up the temperature over a series of weeks? I ask because my favorite fish are fresh angels but since I'm a beginner I'd rather not start with them since I hear they're rather sensitive and they're difficulty is put under intermediate in all the pet stores.

Honestly, I don't know the answer to this one. I've never kept a tropical tank and I always read of Danios being a cold water fish. I have experience with cold water tanks, outdoor ponds and aquaponics systems, but not tropical tanks lol. Tropical tanks take a different set up though... you need lights and thermometers and things that don't normally come with cold water tanks. Quite apart from the fish, it would depend on your tank as to whether it could be converted, as it would need to take a heater, a hood with a light and that sort of thing.

How exactly do you test for ammonia and ph and things? I know of a few ways to test for ph but is there a meter or is it a one use thing or what? how could I do it myself and si it expensive? I'm not crazy about driving down just to get water tested every week.

You need a test kit. You buy them in packages.... you can get dipping strips that will give you a rough idea (and they are cheaper), but the best and most accurate way is to get a water quality kit. Mine I think was about $50 but it lasted years... then you just replace the little bottles of solution as required. The kit has all the testing solutions, the test tubes and the adjustment solutions already in it (hence the cost). For starting out you may find that the strips will be okay, especially if you're doing fortnightly water testing at the aquarium store. You can buy all the little individual testers separately, so build them up slowly. You can also get little cards that hang in the tank and change colours but I've heard they aren't very accurate.

The main things you are testing for are ammonia, nitrite, nitrate and pH. We use an electronic pH meter in the aquaponics tank, but it was quite expensive and we still have to test the ammonia and nitrates/nitrites with a water quality kit. The tricky thing is not to get too caught up in making adjustments and swinging things all over the place. You don't want to rely on your adjustment solutions to correct things... you want to use your results to examine your setup and figure out how to let the environment maintain itself. If you're having water quality issues there's an imbalance in the system somewhere... too many fish, not enough filtration, water not circulating properly, overfeeding... correct those and the tank should equalise. The idea is to have a mostly self-contained system where the bacteria in the filter take care of the waste and you hardly have to do a thing. If you're always having to tweak then you've got a problem somewhere.

I've had goldfish on and off since I was 12. The only reason I have none now is because my 55 gal tank broke and my 30 was already set up as tropical. If you care for them well, they can live a very long time. I had a carnival goldfish for 9 years (and he died when the tank broke...we tried to save them all, but we didn't make it.)

Yeah, my goldfish that lived for 8 years was the equivalent of a carnival fish... I won it in a colouring competition when I was twelve. They are definitely not 'supposed' to be short lived, as so many people think. They're also not supposed to be shoved in a small tank with five other goldfish and a tiny little filter and then overfed by zealous children.

[ChainLightning]

Re: Pets chit chat thread

Just to add a tidbit about the nitrites, nitrates and ammonia, water quality kit: The one I picked up for our 75g ran less than 30 bucks. Along with the test tube vials and the bottles of solution, it came with a booklet (that included a log, to keep track of readings) describing the needs for cold water, tropical and saltwater tanks, as well as corals. Inexpensive and very informative, as well as immensely useful. For like 24.99, on sale.

[Rae'ya]

Re: Pets chit chat thread

Just to add a tidbit about the nitrites, nitrates and ammonia, water quality kit: The one I picked up for our 75g ran less than 30 bucks. Along with the test tube vials and the bottles of solution, it came with a booklet (that included a log, to keep track of readings) describing the needs for cold water, tropical and saltwater tanks, as well as corals. Inexpensive and very informative, as well as immensely useful. For like 24.99, on sale.

That could be the difference between Australia and the US. I think that $50 is worth it... but $30? That's definitely worth it.

[Corvus]

Re: Pets chit chat thread

That's all quite informative. I feel quite prepared now.

My mom is planning to get a betta to keep on her desk. She bought this "betta bowl" and I'm just thinking it's way too small. It's a literal fish bowl with like a booklight attached, It's probably not even a gallon. She says it's specifically made for bettas and her sister in law had one for years in it. Is she right or will it die like I assume it will? I mean she wan't capable of keeping a 10 gallon tank alive.

[Rae'ya]

Re: Pets chit chat thread

That's all quite informative. I feel quite prepared now.

My mom is planning to get a betta to keep on her desk. She bought this "betta bowl" and I'm just thinking it's way too small. It's a literal fish bowl with like a booklight attached, It's probably not even a gallon. She says it's specifically made for bettas and her sister in law had one for years in it. Is she right or will it die like I assume it will? I mean she wan't capable of keeping a 10 gallon tank alive.

It COULD survive, if someone who knew what they were doing was looking after it. Chances are your mum will end up killing it.

I've never kept bettas (we call them Siamese Fighting Fish) but my experience is that people who keep fish in little fishbowls end up not having fish for long. And I just generally have a problem with seeing Fighting Fish in those tiny little box tanks... there is normally no environmental enrichment, no filtration, and nothing that is even remotely responsible fish keeping. Fighting fish are still fish. They still need everything that any other fish does. It's just that they are happier on their own.

I don't know exactly how much space they need, so I don't know whether the size of the bowl is an issue. But normally literal bowls can freak some fish out by warping their vision. And even if the size of the bowl or tank is okay, it still needs filtration, oxygenation and environmental enrichment in it.

[ChainLightning]

Re: Pets chit chat thread

My eldest stepson kept a betta for a good long time. Kept him in a "classic goldfish bowl". Just barely a half gallon of water, with no aeration or filtration, in it. Eventually, he got tired of the hassle in cleaning it, and adding fresh water every other day, He moved the betta into a 10 gallon, that was housing an iridescent shark, a pleco and 2 cory catfish.

Got just a little over three years with the little guy, before experiencing a cold weather snap and an open window, thanks to a young visiting cousin. The betta and one of the cories didn't survive. Thing is, there are so many tropical fish with life spans just around 2 years, mixed with not knowing how old that betta was when he got it, nobody even considered that the betta would have lived much longer, anyway.

Though... they ARE stubborn little buggers. I had a girlfriend, years ago, that kept a betta in a drinking glass, not much bigger than the cup he came in. I'm not sure how long he lived but it was a lot longer than I would have, caged up in something so small. LOL

[Heka]

Re: Pets chit chat thread

In regards to water cycling (what the turtle community I'm in calls it), you need to wait 4-6 weeks. New turtle keepers are encouraged to put the fish in to do it (if you're not worried about them dying, so maybe buy some cheap feeders) before the turtle (or whatever) goes in. Apparently tetras are really sensitive to water quality and will usually die. Guppies don't though. I use the API test kit. The ammonia will rise first (by-product of waste, can take a while) then the nitrite will rise too (both of these are the ones that kill), then the nitrates will rise (these are ok). The water is fully cycled when both the ammonia and nitrite are a 0ppm. Nitrates can sit anywhere from 5ppm to 40. Over around that you should do a water change (only way to keep it in check).

You can buy products to speed up the process (or make it safer, it wasn't faster for me, but my turtles were in the water the whole time with no side effects). I suggest Nutrafin Cycle, and Seachem Prime. AmmoLock is another popular one, though I haven't used it. It locks the free ammonia in the water, which slows the process, but makes it safer. You will still get ammonia readings, but it's supposed to be safe ammonia.

Good luck!

[Clive]

Re: Pets chit chat thread

It's looking like my Melody-dog won't be joining me, as the place I'm living in doesn't allow pets (of any kind, sayeth the house rules), and I certainly can't afford a plane trip for her. She does have a three-year window before her shots and such run out, though, so who knows. If she ends up remaining where she is, she's at least with a family who loves her. It just makes me sad because she was always terrified I would abandon her, and I swore to her I never would. *sigh*

[Burning Shadow Alchemist]

Re: Pets chit chat thread

The mice run free...only in their clear balls of caged mobility.

[Gleb]

Re: Pets chit chat thread

I keep thinking more and more about why do dogs hate cats... Nature? Who knows....
Ok, now I have to take the dog out, and hug the cat almost to death after this.